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How do you deal with chinese near-synonyms?


Aphorisme

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Hi everyone,

 

I would be glad to hear your views and advises concerning the tricky chinese near-synonyms :)

 

I've searched on the Internet but it seems like this topic is a little bit underrated. 

 

Two years ago, while i was speaking chinese, i decided suddenly to use the word "伟大“ instead of the classical "很大“ in a sentence. At that time i had just learned this word so i was happy to use it...but i totally failed as the chinese girl in front of me told me "啊,你的意思是"很大",是不是?“. Needless to say that i was quite disappointed and that i was closed to never try to use new words again. But instead of that I decided to go deep into this problem and to really learn how to distinguish and properly use chinese near-synonyms.

 

At the beginning it was quite easy, because i was essentially learning new words which were not synonyms. But along with my improvements, my vocabulary became wider and wider...and this exercise became harder and harder.

 

Today, I'm tired of learning how to differentiate these near-synonyms. It just has no end. I'm aiming at HSK6 that i will try to pass next november and I'm currently learning the HSK6 vocabulary for this purpose...but HSK6 vocabulary just has too many synonyms. I spend hours and hours trying to distinguish 商品,物品,货物,产品,用品 or 意思,意义,涵义,含义,内涵,意味(着). Sometimes it's not hard as the difference is the same than in english, sometimes it's hard as the differences lie in different places. Moreover i also study chinese law, which has its own vocabulary (as instance 后果,which is neither good nor bad when used in a legal context, while this word implies bad consequences when used in a daily life conversation).

 

Bottom line is that sometimes i have the feeling that i'm waisting my time, and the other students that I met seem to be not interested in this topic...as if this tricky part of chinese does not exist. 

 

I wrote what are, in my opinion, the pros and cons spending time in doing so:

 

Pros:

-A batter grasp of the words that you have learnt, especially the new ones.

-Being able to nuance your statements, just like in your native langage. Very useful when you try to convince someone because you need to use the words that fit the most to the situation.

-Being able to sound more native when speaking/ writing

-A very important one : a friend of mine is very good at reading and understanding oral chinese. She has a great vocabulary and uses flashcards all the time. BUT she speaks and write like a beginner. She always use very basic words and, as instance, even if she can understand the words 意思,意义,涵义,含义,内涵,意味(着), she does not understand the slight differences between each of them and she will always use "意思". If she says for example: "在法律上来讲,过错和过失的区分很有意思“ a chinese will understand, but it's not as good as saying "在法律上来讲,过错和过失的区分很有意义“. Not learning how to properly use new words ends up in always using the same words. As a consequence, there is a huge gap between her active and passive knowledge of chinese. Btw, it's the thing that i really do not like in flashcards...when you reach a certain level, you're stuck. In this perspective, tackling near-synonyms issue seems essential.

-Maybe indispensable if you plan to reach a really high level of proficiency?

 

Cons:

-It really really is time-consuming...is it worth it?

-Quite useless after all: in general, even if you use a word in a bad way, chinese people will still understand your meaning.

-Sometimes very boring

-Even if you spend hours and hours, you can still make mistakes because there always are many exceptions that you have never heard of.

-It constantly reminds you of how much you still have to learn...very depressing in the long run.

 

Here are my thoughts. And sometimes i don't know if it is worth spending so much time or not, especially when you reach a certain level where 75% of the new words are near-synonyms.

 

I would be happy to read your answers about this topic. Do you spend a lot of time trying to differentiate between synonyms? If so, how do you do? Or do you overlook this part of chinese and you're happy like that? Do you think it is worth it?

 

Have a good evening, 

 

Louis

 

P.S: sorry for my poor english, I haven't spoken english for ages...

P.S 2: i have never used flashcards, so my opinion is just based on what i've seen ;)

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In addition to knowing the dictionary meaning of words, you also have to be aware of cultural associations.

So when I hear 伟大,  the first thing I think of is 毛泽东.

http://rongyitang.com/pic/20111117/20111117044217363.jpg

Similarly, I recall a friend years ago telling me not to use 忠 again in ordinary speech because of its Cultural Revolution associations.

 

I'm not saying that for today's generation those particular associations are still valid; I don't know. But I am saying you have to rely on more than what a dictionary says in choosing your vocabulary.

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I want to reach near native fluency someday so this issue is quite important. Personally, I am really interested in learning the right words to exactly express my meaning. Much of it is about being able to fit what you say to the situation at hand but I think this skill only comes with a lot more practise and careful observation of native speakers, there's really no other way of picking up the finer nuances of usage. In fact, as you seem to be finding, dictionary definitions only go so far and are often almost useless unless they come with an exhaustive list of example sentences.

 

My vocabulary is starting to reach the point where this may become an issue for me, but I hope that my interactions with native speakers will increase to the point where arduous rote learning of synonyms will never be necessary.

 

So far I have studied in an extremely discursive manner without a strict schedule. This annoys me at times because I feel that I'm progressing slower than if I had more discipline. But at the same time I'm mostly just having a good time doing things I like with Chinese, like watching TV shows and reading people's blogs. But as you are studying for a test the best way to do things is to study for things on the test. After that though I suggest you take a break and do things you enjoy. Or perhaps, focus on just one set of synonyms, for months maybe, drop them into conversation as often as possible and you will probably (I'm not sure) end up covering most of the variations in usage. It is time consuming but you may eventually make more progress. You could even just ask everyone you meet to quickly give you examples of how to use them. That's just a quick suggestion. Good luck.

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Hi LiMo,

 

Thank you for your advise!

 

It's exactly what I do with my chinese teacher: i just have two hours of chinese lesson per week -i study for the most part on my own- and I spend these two hours asking my teacher how to use these synonyms. I've found out that in general chinese people who are not teacher are really unable to explain the differences between near-synonyms (in general they say: "它们的意思相同“ even if their meaning is more 相近 than 相同)...and even chinese teacher find it difficult. I guess it would be the same for english, but to a less extent because chinese language clearly has much more synonyms than english.

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While I think it's useful to do some research into the odd group of synonyms from time to time, making a habit of it is a waste of time that could be spent consuming native-level material instead.

 

As you read more and talk more with native speakers you'll find you'll start to acquire an unconscious understanding of how different words are used in different situations.

 

It is often claimed that Chinese has a massive vocabulary, rivalling that of English and that's not that surprising given how ancient its history is. You will need to eventually accept the fact that some words are active vocabulary (i.e. words you use everyday), while others will only ever be passive vocabulary (i.e. you can understand them if you read or hear them, but would struggle to use them or even recall them on a whim). There is nothing wrong with this, and indeed native speakers are in much the same situation, though of course there vocabulary as a whole is naturally much larger than us.
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dictionary definitions only go so far and are often almost useless unless they come with an exhaustive list of example sentences.

Are you using a Chinese-Chinese dictionary or a Chinese-English dictionary?

Chinese-Chinese dictionaries are generally far better at explaining the nuances between words.

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While I think it's useful to do some research into the odd group of synonyms from time to time, making a habit of it is a waste of time that could be spent consuming native-level material instead.

 

Agreed. 

 

I get frustrated with this as well and just accept that some is active vocabulary and some is passive. I tend to get caught up in the details but generally follow the 80/20 rule regarding Chinese. 

 

I really recommend you purchase a 同义词词典 if you have not already. It has helped me with those synonyms I can't quite differentiate when and where to use. 

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I would agree that the best way to learn is by reading or listening to tons of native material. If a particular set of synonyms interests you, or bothers you, look it up in a Chinese language reference, so you're still consuming native material, it's just a bit more focused. Often just googling a few of the synonyms together will lead you to a 'when do I use X and when do I use Y' discussion, in Chinese. That's what you want.

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Tooironic, yes you are right there is nothing wrong to have a passive vocabulary. I have actually always thought that it was bad, I don't know why. It's just that I have the feeling that know how to use these synonyms make you able to express with more accuracy your thoughts. 


 


I read a lot but I have never studied in China so I don't have many opportunities to speak with chinese people and to feel the differences :( And I need an HSK6 before being able to go to China to enter a chinese law school, but I can't imagine myself throwing all this vocabulary in my head without knowing how to use it and then discover how to do it one year later while in China :D


 


Imron, I don't use dictionnary but instead I ask to a chinese teacher who is really clever and know how to explain the differences. I've tried with chinese-chinese dictionnary but as soon as I close the dictionnary I forgot the difference. It doesn't stick in my head in this way. I also google a lot 百度知道, and i find it quite useful.


 


Anonymoose, great explanation. I agree that learning characters is a great way to understand words, and for every single word that I learn i also learn the meaning of the two characters. It makes much more sens  and it's easier to remember. The thing is maybe half of the time this technic  work...but for the other half it doesn't. Maybe i should have chosen an other example :) 


 


The 80/20 rule regarding Chinese?

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The 80/20 rule regarding Chinese?

Its also called the Pareto principle. Generally speaking, roughly 80% of effects come from 20% of the causes. 

 

Its just a way to think about prioritizing your time when studying, depending upon your goals. I've learned that I can make great strides when studying Chinese by not spending too much time focusing on details, many of them come with time and exposure. The time required focussing on and mastering details is a lot greater than learning something more "general." In terms of synonyms, in the time i spend mastering the usage of half a dozen synonyms, I could probably learn 30 words in a new subject. 

 

​Some argue that you have to learn it all in the end. Thats true which is why it depends on your goals. When I say "80/20 rule" its just a concept I use when referring to prioritizing your time and effort. Some of my college classmates thought I was lazy when I preached this mantra. However, its worked out so far for me. 

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  • 6 months later...

If I can just reawaken this thread, what I'm looking for right now is short essays, in Chinese, devoted to what anonymoose does in #7: explaining the differences between near-synonyms and when to use them. If I read the essays in Chinese, it's not a waste of time, is it? Often, after I read something, my flashcard deck will be full of words that mean the same thing, or nearly. At the moment, I've got about 10 ways of saying mock/tease/make fun of/satirize, and as I'm struggling to remember most of them, reading a short prose passage that contains them all and explains how they're different and when to use them or not use them would be killing two birds with one stone. I've got a few paper versions of this, but they usually only compare two words at a time. Also is there anything like this online?

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