Zhende ma? Posted April 2, 2004 at 07:40 AM Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 at 07:40 AM Hi, I was wondering if anyone could guide me on correct usage of 之 and 的. When you have a word or phrase modifying the subject. I've seen them used in similar situations. I think 之 is more for written language but I'm not sure. Any help is appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylee Posted April 2, 2004 at 08:57 AM Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 at 08:57 AM I would say mostly we use 的. 之 is mostly used in set phrases, idioms, proverbs, poems, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kentsuarez Posted April 2, 2004 at 10:27 AM Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 at 10:27 AM Yes, use 的 at first, as it is colloquial; 之 is mostly classical, with various meanings, and it will sound funny if you try to use it as a simple replacement for 的. When you hit very advanced levels you'll start to get a feel for when it is ok to use 之 in writing and occasionally even in speech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geek_frappa Posted April 2, 2004 at 01:44 PM Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 at 01:44 PM 之 is used in mathematics to delimit fractions and percentages... 6/8 http://chinese.primezero.com/pzcdz/u.php?search=6%2F8 88% http://chinese.primezero.com/pzcdz/u.php?search=88%25 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39degN Posted April 2, 2004 at 03:18 PM Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 at 03:18 PM yes, i just found the regulation right now: when NEXT word is a single character, we always use 之, otherwise(two-character word, more-character word), you can always use 的, despite whether that we can change it to 之 examples: 美国之音 中国之旅 太行之巅 你我之间 and there are lot of examples with 的, u can just find it by yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ala Posted April 3, 2004 at 02:20 AM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 02:20 AM 之 is the classical genitive. 的 is pretty recent, I think first appeared in Ming text. And applies only to Mandarin. Southern dialects tend to use ge/ga. 之 is typically used as a genitive for morphemes in ONE WORD (like: 味之素 for MSG; or fractions, etc), or as a short headline-like clause (you see it often for journal titles); while 的 is used for clauses in conversational grammar. Since all Japanese words have a character equivalent, the possessive "no" の can also be written as 之. 之 is often used temporal clauses as well, and very common in Shanghainese: 白相好之以后...我 (After playing， I... ). In SH, we can also say 电视看之前头... (Before watching TV...). But like 39degN said, in Mandarin, usually single character word follows the 之 as in 玩好之后... 之 can also mean "that" in classical Chinese. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quest Posted April 3, 2004 at 02:46 AM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 02:46 AM 之前，之后? same thing in Mandarin and Cantonese. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper Posted April 3, 2004 at 02:56 AM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 02:56 AM when NEXT word is a single character, we always use 之 我的书？ 美丽的花？ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nnt Posted April 3, 2004 at 05:40 AM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 05:40 AM 你的错 ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ananda Posted April 3, 2004 at 06:42 AM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 06:42 AM trooper -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: when NEXT word is a single character, we always use 之 我的书？ 美丽的花？<This 的 is following an adjective and has different meaning as the former one which means 'of'.> well, when use 之, the next NOUN is often a single character in modern chinese. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roddy Posted April 3, 2004 at 08:24 AM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 08:24 AM when NEXT word is a single character, we always use 之 我之天! I never knew that . . . Roddy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39degN Posted April 3, 2004 at 03:07 PM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 03:07 PM haha, you guys are really sharp, so let me fix my conclusion: in most cases.... you see, the researching of theory is really a difficult work. so the safer way is, never touching it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roddy Posted April 3, 2004 at 03:25 PM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 03:25 PM But like 39degN said, in Mandarin, usually single character word follows the 之 as in 玩好之后... So would it be accurate to say that after 之 you usually get a single-character word, but after 的 it can be either. Seems likely to me, with 之 being more classical, and classical Chinese being more monosyllabic. yes, i just found the regulation right now: So where was it 'found'? Roddy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39degN Posted April 3, 2004 at 03:50 PM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 03:50 PM hehe, i think i didnt make it clear, i meant, i just got a conclusion by myself, i m sorry for that. i will collect enough knock-down arguments to prove my point next time... Seems likely to me, with 之 being more classical, and classical Chinese being more monosyllabic. yeah, it is, also, skylee and kentsuarez's points are right, but I just wanted to find a regulation there as a plus. Seems it failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper Posted April 3, 2004 at 04:01 PM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 04:01 PM Good try though. It got me thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39degN Posted April 3, 2004 at 04:17 PM Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 at 04:17 PM 谢谢鼓励！ 我会继续努力的~~~！（周星弛语） Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geek_frappa Posted April 4, 2004 at 01:55 AM Report Share Posted April 4, 2004 at 01:55 AM 有問題! 兩邊均被夾緊之物 <----- is it true that beautiful women in beijing come in pairs? please don't ban me... i used 之 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39degN Posted April 5, 2004 at 02:53 PM Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 at 02:53 PM 兩邊均被夾緊之物 <----- is it true that beautiful women in beijing come in pairs? please don't ban me... i used 之 hey,buddy, your words look like from erotic fiction... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhende ma? Posted April 5, 2004 at 03:01 PM Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 at 03:01 PM 大家多谢！(I hope this word order is correct!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
39degN Posted April 5, 2004 at 03:08 PM Report Share Posted April 5, 2004 at 03:08 PM incorrect! try it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and select your username and password later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.