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Kenny同志

reprinted by permission from X versus reprinted with permission from X

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Kenny同志

I reckon both phrases are correct as they are so common in publications, but are there any subtle differences?

Cheers!

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imron

Personally, I would say 'with permission' rather than 'by permission'. I can't give you a reason, to me it just sounds better.

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Kenny同志

Thanks Imron.

I prefer "with permission" too. The reason I posted this was that Daniel W. Byrne used "by permission" in his book Publishing Your Medical Research Paper which had been widely acclaimed as a masterpiece on using good English, or rather, good medical English.

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skylee
I can't give you a reason, to me it just sounds better.

This sounds familiar. Is it because you are a native speaker? :D

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Daan

While I agree "with permission" sounds better, I think "by permission" is actually quite common, too.

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HedgePig

If using "by permission", wouldn't it be better better to say "by permission of X" rather than by "permission from X"? This sounds more natural to me.

I feel that "by permission" sounds more official, so if one is formally stated that one has obtained formal, legal permission, possibly from an organisation rather than a person, then "by permssion of" would be more commonly used. However, if the situation is slightly less formal then "with permission from" seems slightly more common.

Just my opinion.

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Silent

I feel there is a difference though it may very well be imaginary. When 'with permission from' is used I feel someone (legal entity) has explicitly given permission. If 'by permission of' is used I feel it may very well be that no explicite permission is given but that the permission is derived. E.g. by permission of law blabla.... or that the 'one' given permission is not a well defined or recognised legal entity 'by permission of the members of the senate..... If explicit permission is given it sounds more formal to me.

The construction 'by permission from' sounds very weird to me. It wouldn't surprise me if it's incorrect or an archaic form.

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imron
Is it because you are a native speaker?

Absolutely :D Which means although I can't tell you why, I can tell you which one sounds better.

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animal world

I also prefer reprinted with permission from X. I also agree with what silent said, i.e. that there may be a distinction as silent alluded to but it may well be imaginary. I can't think of any grammar rule that warrants this distinction. My suggestion to you, Kenny, is that you seek legal counsel prior to committing yourself to either version in a translation for a client ;)

Just for kicks, can you post a few paragraphs from this masterpiece in the medical language for us?

Just because something is in common use nowadays, doesn't necessarily mean that it's correct. Lately, I've been hearing quite a few people saying in casual conversations : "...and I think to myself blablabla." This mistake is comical because you can't think to anyone else. They are probably confusing this with, "and I say to myself ...."

Kenny, it seems your command over English has increased tremendously since I visited here a year ago or whenever it was!

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Kenny同志

Thanks everybody for your help.

I am terribly sorry for my belated reply but I’ve been quite busy since the other day.

I am also sorry I didn’t check the book before my posting and thus miswrote the phrase in the title – it should be “reprinted by permission of X”, not “from”.

@Animal World

I wasn’t seeking legal advice; the post was actually a language learning question.

I don’t think I would attempt any Chinese-English translation for money within two or three years unless I know for certain that my translations will be revised by a native English-speaking professional.

For kicks, I am afraid I can only post a few sentences because the book is copyrighted.

Here they go:

Examples of How Sentences Can Be Improved by Deleting the Word “There”

(“O” stands for “Original” and “I” for “Improved”)

O: There has been an increase in the number of patients …

I: More patients are…

O: There were no pulmonary emboli or deep wound infections.

I: No pulmonary emboli or deep wound infections occurred.

O: There were 63 patients with …

I: Sixty-three patients had …

O: There were seven pregnancies …

I: Seven infants had…

O: There was a significant increase in adverse outcome …

I: Adverse outcome increased significantly…

O: There is evidence to suggest that those who cease smoking…

I: Those who cease smoking may …

Quoted from Publishing Your Medical Research Paper by Daniel W. Byrne

Is it true my English has improved greatly? Well, I often struggle with words when I want to express things clearly. Haha

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Michaelyus

The "by permission from" is the most straighforward case to delineate: it refers specifically to reprinting and reusing material that already exists, hence it is taken "from" that material or body. In such cases, "by permission" may be surrounded by commas; but even without them it carries this meaning. Hence it differs from "with permission from" in that "from" here focuses on the permission, rather than the material. Unless it is surrounded by commas, in which case it is the same as the above. A slight difference of rhythm and intonation upholds the difference in speech.

I agree that "by permission of" is more formal in the sense of more legalistic, but I also agree it is mainly imaginary in practice. "The permission of X" does imply a formal agreement, but it need not be so in real life.

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animal world

@Animal World

I wasn’t seeking legal advice; the post was actually a language learning question.

Kenny, i was just joking; hence the wink, ;) at the end of my legal advice.

Yes, your English has definitely improved quite a bit. I suspect that you devote a lot of time to mastering English.

The examples you gave of the author's showing how one's writing can be improved, i.e. how to avoid "there is/there are" sentence constructions are all valid. There is/there are is always very weak. But, it's also basic. So far, i haven't detected the genius of the author of this expensive book yet :)

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Kenny同志

Thanks Michael for helping me understand the phrases. :)

@Animal World

Haha, thanks for letting me know my English has improved.

As for the book, I know I can’t convince you of its greatness or anything because I am not allowed to provide any more of its content. Anyway, I personally think it’s a superb guide to novice writers like me. The reviews on Amazon are also very positive. :D

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