Temporarily forgetting how to write very basic characters

[Demonic_Duck]

I seem to have this problem whereby I'm writing something out by hand and suddenly hit a really common, basic character and realise I've forgotten how to write it, and have to think for a minute or two before I remember. Fairly recently, this has happened with 你, 方, even 的 (although in the case of 的 I was trying to write the character in isolation). This normally happens when I'm very tired, but all the same I feel like it shouldn't be happening (I'm around HSK4 level, at least in reading ability). Is this a common problem?

[gato]

(I'm around HSK4 level, at least in reading ability).

Reading ability is completely separate from the ability to recall and write characters by hand.

[Demonic_Duck]

I dispute that it's completely separate, sometimes I'll find that I've "learnt" how to write characters without ever having written them, simply from having seen them written down so many times. However, I take your point that they're essentially two different skills. Nevertheless, even though I certainly wouldn't say I'm good at writing by any stretch of the imagination, I feel I should be way above the level where I'm forgetting how to write the most common characters. I can write level-appropriate homework assignments of ~300 characters without having to look up every other character (maybe it's every fourth or fifth character, but still...)

[roddy]

I don't think it's that unusual. Make sure they're all in some kind of SRS practice rotation (or that you're doing enough writing they'll come up of their own accord), and don't do any exams while tired. Hell, you can forget to write your own name if you're tired enough.

They might have been well-learned, but that doesn't mean they're completely unconscious and automatic.When you're writing are you thinking stroke by stroke, or can you basically switch off.

[li3wei1]

I'm around HSK4 level, at least in reading ability

A more appropriate statistic may be your age.

[alanalian]

It happens on me too even I am a native Chinese speaker. The most effective way to remember the Chinese characters is to write them out rather than 'type' them out.

[Scoobyqueen]

@liwei what has age got to do with it? Is the abilty to remember shapes and patterns age related?

[li3wei1]

The ability to remember all kinds of things is age-related, once you reach a certain age. Where your keys are, why you came upstairs, who you were supposed to call, the names of your children. I have no idea how old the OP is, I'm just offering a possible explanation for memory failure.

[skylee]

Is this a common problem?

We call it 執(提)筆忘字.

[Scoobyqueen]

@ liwei. Ok I missed the intended wit here.

(though I do believe that age can be an advantage also especially where someone knows several language and can use his experience to understand something such as grammar/linguistics/pronunciation or language acquisition methods)

On another note. Chinese often highlight that the Chinese language stimulates all areas of the brain, ie one part for learning to read/recognise characters, another part for writing/remembering characters, and a nother one for speaking (as in other language) and listening. I have heard several Chinese people says this. Since so many different areas of the brain are involved it is probably natural that you might not be good at some things (like remembering how to write characters) but you migh be very good at something else such as speaking. That makes Chinese quite interesting.

[roddy]

Are these Chinese people neurologists?

[Scoobyqueen]

It is a well known fact that the brain uses different areas of the brain to process languages (listening, speaking for example use different parts). Do you have to be a neurolinguist to talk about that?

There was a previous thread on this:

http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/4536-is-chinese-read-with-a-different-area-of-the-brain/

that seem to suggest Chinese use more of their brain (written by laymen)

[laurenth]

I seem to have this problem whereby I'm writing something out by hand and suddenly hit a really common, basic character and realise I've forgotten how to write it,

In your sentence, replace "character" by "word" and I can tell you that I sometimes have the same problem in my very own mother tongue (French). So I'm annoyed, but not that surprised, when, just like you, I can't remember how to write very basic Chinese characters.

[Demonic_Duck]

I seem to have this problem whereby I'm writing something out by hand and suddenly hit a really common, basic character and realise I've forgotten how to write it,

In your sentence, replace "character" by "word" and I can tell you that I sometimes have the same problem in my very own mother tongue (French). So I'm annoyed, but not that surprised, when, just like you, I can't remember how to write very basic Chinese characters.

Sure, I have this problem in English with words like "connoisseur", "raconteur", even "hygiene" (coincidentally all borrowed from French...) but I never have this issue with words like "it" or "the". Perhaps a better analogue is forgetting which version of "your/you're" or "there/they're/their" to use - something I've internalised well enough that I have no problems under normal circumstances, but occasionally catch myself mixing up when I'm dog-tired.

Regarding the age issue, I'm only 23, although I generally get the impression that my memory is atrocious for my age, and I dread to think what it'll be like by the time I hit 60.

[Ruben von Zwack]

You mean you completely forget the whole word, or that you still remember that it has radical xyz on the upper right, but what again was the lower half... That happens to me when I haven't used a word a long time, and especially when I learned that word by route.

Or maybe what you experience is something like the "tip of the tongue" symptom?

About that theory of the superior Hanzi brain ;) ... once someone mastered the Latin Alphabet, they also read the words like Chinese characters, i.e. recognise them as a unit, and not spell them out letter for letter.

[tominchina]

I definitely agree that this is fairly normal and my experience is that although I can 'recognize' a character in context if I have to write it down and haven't used it in a long time I will forget how to write it. Since in my 'life' I am not often writing characters this isn't really a problem. I'm normally typing them or saying them and as such, as a foreigner living here, while it would be 'nice' to remember how to write everything down - its not critical.

[陳德聰]

What drives me nuts is when I write internal parts of characters backwards, or characters in words out of order, and then once I see it on the paper realize it's wrong and have to erase and rewrite.

舒, 疑 are two I can think of off the top of my head that I have written with left and right sides reversed at least enough times to remember off the top of my head that I've done it, and the most notorious offender for words is 继续, which I almost always start writing as 续继 and I have no idea why my brain will not let me write it properly on the first try.

[skylee]

I can 'recognize' a character in context if I have to write it down and haven't used it in a long time I will forget how to write it.

This is what happened yesterday. I wanted to write the word "tranche". I had seen it many many times and of course understood what it means, but I couldn't spell it right. I knew it starts with tr and ends with ch but somehow I could not figure out the spelling. I only got "trench" in my head, which I knew was wrong. So I typed in google "trench of funding" and it gave me the right spelling. End of story. Nothing special or worth discussing imho.

[imron]

and the most notorious offender for words is 继续

够 is also bad for this, not least because in traditional it's written 夠

[anonymoose]

Good reason not to learn both character sets then. Can't say I've ever had this problem.