How to spot a REAL graded reader (and know the fakes)

[Rufus]

This may poke a hornets nest of discussion, but that's what a discussion forum is for. My new blog post identifies the three characteristics of a REAL graded reader and also identifies what is NOT a graded reader. 

 

Three Fool-Proof Ways to Know a Graded Reader When You See One

 

We've got a diversity of opinions around here, I'd love to hear your take on this, for or against. As you can see, I've staked out my position on the matter. What do you think?

[Demonic_Duck]

I'm not seeing much new or controversial here, except that you list "a collection of short articles" as something that's not a graded reader (if the articles are all graded to the same level, what's the crucial difference between that and a story-based graded reader in multiple chapters?)

[realmayo]

Reads like an advertisment masquerading as an argument.

 

Except it's hardly an argument. 

[ChTTay]

I just bought 中文天天读 (3b) to take part in a group reading on this forum. It's essentially a collection of short texts and stories.

As far as I can see they are all graded to the same level. The variety of topics keeps it interesting. They are short enough that finishing one of them is an easily obtainable goal.

Longer graded readers can be pretty dull. I tried to read one called "our geese have gone" and have started it about 4 times. It's just not enjoyable.

Anyway, I'm thinking of moving onto native Chinese versions of English books soon.

Also agree with Realmayo. If you want to generate some discussion on graded readers, It would be better if you just posted up your opinion/thoughts/experiences and any questions you have in a casual, forum-y way. Rather than a discussion that leads nicely to your blog posts and, in turn, your own graded reader series (which I am a fan of).

[Shelley]

Maybe I will be showing my ignorance of the subject but I have never heard of fake graded readers, the idea never even occurred to me.

 

Not so much a hornets nest as a storm in a teacup. And yes, a thinly veiled advertisement.

[imron]

less than >1%

Less than or greater than?

[lechuan]

I'd  suggest removing references to "real" and "fakes" and other absolutes, and simply explain what Mandarin Companion feels are important aspects to have in a graded reader. Let the reader decide for themselves if other resources they're reading accomplish these as well.

[dwq]

I think your passion is better used to improve your product than to think of new ways to market it.  You could turn people off with thinly-veiled advertisements like this (you may not intend it to be such but it surely reads like one.)

[Rufus]

Hey guys, I doubt few of the readers on this part of the forum have not yet heard about Mandarin Companion so it's not intended to be a thinly veiled ad. What this is based on is the widely accepted criteria for "true" graded readers by the academics at the ER Foundation. Without actually stating it in the article, I say that Chinese Breeze and our series are the only true Chinese graded readers in the market. ChTTay brings up the level of interest in a story, and while I understand how a story can be immensely uninteresting, that's not something quantifiable but should be an important element of any graded reader.

 

But if you want to get an idea of my point of reference, you can see the full list of English graded readers here: https://sites.google.com/site/erfgrlist/. I just looked at the updated list (haven't check this year) and they've added a lot of titles to a total of about 5,000 graded readers. So I was wrong, we have about 20 Chinese graded readers compared to about 5,000 English graded readers (or about %0.4 for imron  ). 

[Tianjin42]

Rufus,

 

I have been getting into graded readers and was considering buying the ones you are marketing but these repeated attempts to promote them here (followed up by some rather insincere explanations) are starting to dissuade me.

 

I think it can be positive to mention commercial ventures that might be useful to the group but these limp attempts to drum up interest in the product feel awkward. If the product is strong it doesn’t require this form of marketing.

 

I intend to declare an interest in a venture of my own soon, but will try to do so in a respectful and transparent manner. 

[ChTTay]

Perhaps, In the future, try just posting "normally". No links to your blog / books apart from the one in your signature. Start a discussion, see where it goes. As you say, people are aware of Mandarin Companion now so I'm sure they can find your blog posts if they are interested.

[戴 睿]

I feel the time spent advertising mandarin companion would be much better used if it were dedicated to the development of graded readers above the 300 word level.

[icebear]

Hey guys, I doubt few of the readers on this part of the forum have not yet heard about Mandarin Companion so it's not intended to be a thinly veiled ad. 

 

I have no doubt that you are completely tone deaf to the views of many regulars on this forum about what is an acceptable style of post, especially when incorporating outside content.

 

At least try to clever/subdued about it. You could have started the discussion with just your last line and a sentence of your thoughts, let that played out a bit, and then shared a link later on saying you've expanded your views. You could have easily summarized your blogs points into 3-4 sentences/bullets without requiring the obnoxious link. Tact is also pretty low, as others have noted, by basically calling anything else on the market "a fake". By now you should be realizing that your style of posts may be souring some potential customers, even if drums up a few more superficial hits on your blog.

 

As it stands, this still comes across as a "strong sell" tactic. In the future when new users look up Mandarin Companion for reviews they'll also find a large number of posts with people complaining about your style of guerrilla advertorials. Good job.

[realmayo]

Also the actual post linked is not logically correct: consider:

 

Unfortunately, there are some books which call themselves “graded readers” which claim to use a vocabulary of 500 words in multiple stories, each 100-150 words in length. Obviously, as the math shows, if every word was used only once (which would be impossible to do) then it would need to be at least 500 words in length.  Basically, the more words used in the book, the longer the book should be in order to provide enough repetition.

 

This assumes that every single word used in the book is brand new to the reader. Which is a silly assumption. It assumes that a book which uses a vocabulary of 500 words is intending to teach the reader every single one of those. Again, I just don't see this. It looks like the OP doesn't understand how graded readers work. I'm sure he does, but that's how it looks.

[gato]

That quoted paragraph mixes up how long stories should be and how long books should be. Beginners who know only less than 500 words might not be able to tolerate very long stories. You don't need long articles to have repetition as long as you repeat words between the articles. Criticizing other readers for having short articles on that ground is not really on point.

A problem he doesn't mention is that stories that are short might be too short to develop an interesting stories, however.

[Rufus]

I am really sorry about this post. I clearly didn't think through it before hitting submit. Using the word "fake", among other things, was certainly a poor choice of words and in actuality not exactly what I had in mind. I was more trying to draw a clearer definition of what is generally accepted as a graded reader in the English as a Second Language community. Typically other materials which are not classified as graded readers are commonly used for intensive reading. I'll take your comments to heart.

 

And a quick reply to 戴 睿, right now we're selecting the titles for level 2. @Gato, you have an excellent point about having interesting stories. While this is hard to quantify (which is why I didn't address it), it's really important factor for learner motivation.