online study vs language school

[hongputaojiu]

So here is my current problem. I want to do a 6 week intensive this summer to prep for HSK 5 in September. 

 

I currrently work in China so it should be a matter of just choosing a language school and going, right?

 

The problem is, the last two language schools I went to the teaching was just so-so. Not bad, just not great. I picked provincial language schools as costs included accommodation, roughly 3000RMB a week for 1-1 2hrs per week.

 

The costs in Beijing would be at least 3000RMB per week + accommodation. This is a big investment.

 

For 80-100RMB per hour I can have a class through skype and stay at home.

 

As my lessons are 1-1 in the language school, I am wondering what disadvantage there would be.

 

Has anyone done both and have any suggestions about it?

 

cheers

hongputaojiu

[Flickserve]

I think 1-1 is a bit tricky and very individual. Some students might not be clear about how to learn or not believe/enjoy the most efficient methodology. And, it is quite possible different methods might have to be mixed into the equation.

Then again, the instructor also has to be sensitive to those needs to be able retain the interest. So it is a two way process.

Perhaps you can analyse more carefully about what is so-and-so teaching and what is great teaching for you. Then you can guide the teaching a bit more to your personal style.

[hongputaojiu]

@flickserve

 

I have found the majority of teachers in China to very much a cookie cutter of each other. Actually my major is elementary education so I have a solid background in the philosophy of how learners best learn. Its just that the Chinese Normal university programs don't graduate well rounded educators, in my opinion.

 

However, I am really just now trying to weigh up online vs language school, as these are the options available to me at this stage.

 

Any thoughts on this?

[Flickserve]

So you are a person with discerning tastes. My personal opinion is that you have nothing to lose by trying online and seeing if it works for you.

What if it doesn't work for you? Would you not take HSK 5?

[onebir]

Might be worth checking out TLI; I did a few weeks there way back & found the teachers, materials & admin staff all very good & helpful (although my level was maybe HSK3). In Beijing they're on a uni campus (International Youth Uni?), and offer(ed?) cheapish spartan single rooms in little flats with shared living rooms. I asked for a foreign flatmate & ended up wandering around Chaoyang chatting with a bearllike Japanese guy in Mandarin

 

http://www.bjtli.cn/

[hongputaojiu]

@onebir thanks I have sent them an email so interested to see if they are still running programs.

 

@Flickserve discerning tastes? not sure about that, just an expectation of solid teaching methodology. of course I will still take the hsk, that is not relevant. The issue is the ratio of time and money vs increase in outcomes due to teacher influence. Should the teacher influence be negligible, then my time and money need to be better invested. 

 

thanks for the ideas guys.

[li3wei1]

If you're getting 1-1 in both situations, the deciding factor should be cost. But also bear in mind that with the school, you pay a whole lot upfront and if you don't like the teacher you're stuck, whereas with online, you can try 20 teachers and pick the one you like the best, and if you subsequently get tired of them you can move on.

[abcdefg]

The problem is, the last two language schools I went to the teaching was just so-so. Not bad, just not great. I picked provincial language schools as costs included accommodation, roughly 3000RMB a week for 1-1 2hrs per week.

 

@Hongputaojiu -- How many hours a week? I think there must have been a typo. One would need to receive 10 to 20 hours or so per week for it to make any sense at all.

 

1. Is you current schedule such that you could just try out on-line instruction starting now, maybe with a minimum number of hours? If it works out well, you could ramp it up in the summer when you have more time.

 

2. Also, not sure where you currently are in China and what you living situation is, but if you could continue living there this summer and just take class in the same town it might mean less expense. Would that be feasible?

 

Has anyone done both and have any suggestions about it?

 

I've done both. It's real easy for Skype-based lessons to get boring. That's the main drawback I found. As to face to face, so much depends on the competence, motivation, imagination, and interpersonal skills of the individual teacher. Cannot just count on a program with a good reputation being able to hit a home run with your own personal instruction.

[onebir]

"But also bear in mind that with the school, you pay a whole lot upfront and if you don't like the teacher you're stuck"

Less so at bigger schools like TLI; I seem to recall getting some say over choice of teachers after the first week. Also I think a lot of their students are embassy staff, so they might not be too busy over the summer, due to holidays. (Worth checking with them.)

 

I see it's RMB 130/h now though - a bit steep.

[roddy]

If you're in China, would it be possible to audition a bunch of teachers for an hour or two, then stick with the one or two best for an intensive period. Seems like that's the best of both worlds to me - you can cut out the middleman school and have real live classes. If you know your education you should have a decent chance of spotting a good one. 

[abcdefg]

I've used the method you are suggesting, Roddy. It can work if there is an ample supply of candidates. But maybe he lives in a small town where there are very few teachers of Chinese as a second language.

[thechamp]

I did this when I was living in Sichuan, and took a month of holiday to go to Yangshuo and study there for HSK 5 preparation. I think the thing with HSK preparation is that most of what you're doing is repeating the old exams so the teacher doesn't necessarily need to be too good, they just need to be hot on their grammar stuff and also be able to explain sometimes why you've got a question wrong. In the reading section there are some really weird questions 'suggest a name for this short story' etc....and the name that is the 'right' answer can seem quite unusual. It's a test of your cultural awareness but sometimes those questions still threw me. Also, another really good thing to get drilled on is the writing section which is easily the hardest part of HSK 5 and 6 and is something that I think most people who predominantly self study are quite bad at.

[hongputaojiu]

Hi guys - thanks to everyone who has made the time to give some advice.

 

I live in small Chinese city of 7 million. 

 

There are plenty of language schools around charging ridiculous amounts (think 150-200RMB per hour) for 1-1.

 

I have met with them all  in the time I have lived here, and have chosen one, with an excellent teacher from Dong Bei for 100 per hour. Unfortunately she cannot commit to intensive schedule over the summer. So there is that. 

 

Call me old fashioned but I just can't get past paying more that 100 kuai an hour for Chinese class! 

 

@abcdefg yeah I meant to say 20hrs per week

[hongputaojiu]

@thechamp - I just wanted to ask you if you felt the extra surcharge for studying HSK classes was worth it? I have always avoided hsk classes as they seem to be more expensive than regular, and i was figuring that the comprehensive classes would end up covering the same vocab over time. 

[thechamp]

Yeah but tbh before you start studying HSK 5 or 6 I would say you should probably passively know the vocab. The difficulty of those exams isn't the vocab or comprehension, it's time and how exact some of the more specific questions are. The grammar questions in HSK 6 are occasionally really quite hard (I was preparing for 6 initially then changed to 5 after realising that grammar section was easily failable). 5 still has some tough reading questions though, and the writing is harder than most foreigners think because it's quite stringently marked. My point is essentially that preparing for the advanced HSKs doesn't have much to do with Chinese proficiency - they're quite specific exams and you really should find a teacher who knows how to prep people for them. I actually think that given good teaching you could go very quickly from 5 to 6. I never did 6 in the end but the exams follow a rubric where it would be totally possible to get awesome at taking HSKs (with good tuition) and just do both in succession.

[abcdefg]

I live in small Chinese city of 7 million.

 

@Hongputaojiu, where do you live? Maybe someone has advice specific to your location. 150 to 200 Yuan per hour really is a lot. I would balk at paying that, just like you. Especially if outside Beijing or Shanghai.

 

One summer I had an excellent teacher here in Kunming who taught Chinese to  local native kids in middle school during the academic year. She was on holiday for the summer and taught me one-to-one for considerably less than the going rate. She knew only a little English and did not like using it, which was fine with me, since I much prefer maintaining a Chinese language learning environment. I learned a lot from her, and had fun doing it, even though my study goals were not the same as yours.

[hongputaojiu]

thanks guys. yeah im in hangzhou. the issue for me has been with the language schools that I have been to visit (and its been a lot!) has been: 

 

-expensive

-no teachers from the north, so their putonghua is def not standard

-no discerning special teaching materials or approach that would make me want to fork out 100s of kuai per hour.

 

I have an excellent teacher at the moment who is from dongbei, but she cannot commit to the intensive hours I need/want over the next few months.

 

also, I did a trial lesson with tutorming.com last night. They have an interesting online class platform which I havent seen before. Basically its a Taiwanese based company but the teacher they had was based in anhui. They provide a recording of the lesson. Its 100 kuai for 45mins. So also not cheap. And they want 100hrs paid up front.

 

I am trialling mychinesetutor.org tomorrow

 

decisions decisons......

[hongputaojiu]

@abcdefg what were/are your language goals? I am using HSK just as a method to improve my fluency and ability to communicate more smoothly at work and life generally

[Flickserve]

Is it a usual practice to be charging more for HSK 5/6 classes?

[hongputaojiu]

if you look at most language school price lists, the cost of a program for hsk classes is higher. not exactly sure what the justification is as to me in theory learning vocab, grammar, etc should be kinda the same. but anyway that seems to be how they do it here generally speaking.