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Correct measure word for passport


Christa

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From the Chinese embassy UK website:

 

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如您没有有效中国护照和有效在英签证或居留证件,也不能提供英内政部(HOME OFFICE)出具的您正在办理或即将获得合法签证或居留的材料,而想申请一本护照,需要您本人亲自前来使领馆递交申请,但取证时可委托他人凭取证单代取。

 

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Now I wonder if there is a difference in measures words between 'there were two passports on the embassy employee's desk' and 'her mother is British and her father American, so she has two passports'.

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This is perhaps somewhat irrelevant, but I've noticed many quite well educated speakers using 个 even for things like 书 when speaking to me. I find this surprising because I use to think that using 个 instead of proper measure words was largely something associated with children.

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14 hours ago, anonymoose said:

If you mean she has two passports from different countries, then 国.

I did a quick search on this, but as I read it, 两国护照 doesn't really look like number - measure word - noun, but rather like a shortening of 两个国家的护照. My paper dictionary doesn't list 国 as a measure word either.

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1 hour ago, somethingfunny said:

I canvassed some people and the consensus seems to be 本.  That's also the one provided in my dictionary.

 

(Obviously, in addition to 个, which is probably what I would use.)

 

So, does that mean both are actually alright to use?

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On 1/18/2018 at 12:08 PM, anonymoose said:

If you mean she physically has two passport books, then it should still be 本. If you mean she has two passports from different countries, then 国.

 

This makes a lot of sense to me, but I wonder if it is really a "measure word" in this case? 兩國護照 "feels" to me like an abbreviation of 兩個國家的護照. Is it still a measure word?

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9 hours ago, anonymoose said:

I'm not sure that fundamentally there is a difference.

I think there is a pretty clear distinction between nouns and measure words. Some nouns can be measure words and some measure words can be nouns, but in one phrase, a word is either a measure word or a noun, not both at the same time. I'm not a linguist and am perfectly willing to be convinced that I'm wrong in this, but this is how I see it.

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To me passports has always been booklets so it's always 本.  Perhaps in some other era / some countries I don't know of a passport could have been a piece of paper in which case 張 can apply.  But 個 does not sound right to me, it sounds like it is referring to 護照 as a concept (like to right to have a passport from a country) but not to the physical booklet (perhaps because, to me, 一個書 is completely unacceptable).

 

OTOH, 簽證 visas come in many forms: a stamp, a sticker, or a separate document and I use 一個簽證 most of the time, but I think 一張簽證 is also used.

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