Why is 家 the measure word for shops / restaurants etc?

[Christa]

Hi everyone,

 

Got four questions that I wondered if anyone had a good answer to, all about 家.

 

The first is: why is 家 the measure word for shops / restaurants etc? Is it simply because they were traditionally family run? Or is it more because  家 implies somewhere where there are a number of people in a building together?

 

The second is: why is 家 not the measure word for things like schools or museums? Is it because, as I suggested above, this classified is for things that were traditionally family run?

 

The third is: am I right in think that you would normally use 家 for supermarkets but 个 for markets? If so, why do you think that is? Does there need to be some sort of building present for us to be able to use 家?

 

The fourth is: when it's just on its own - so without 庭 or 人 being added to it - would you say its basic meaning is more "home" or "family"?

 

It's an interesting word, so I would be very interested in learning more.

 

 

Christa

[Lu]

For your fourth question, I suggest this short documentary. Not because it will answer your question directly, but because it will make it even more complicated ?

[Christa]

23 minutes ago, Lu said:

For your fourth question, I suggest this short documentary. Not because it will answer your question directly, but because it will make it even more complicated ?

 

Lu, you are both lovely and evil at the same time ?

 

My revenge should be to ask four more questions.

 

It's an interesting documentary. How did you come across it?

[Lu]

3 minutes ago, Christa said:

It's an interesting documentary. How did you come across it?

I received it on a Leiden mailing list about Asian research stuff. Here is a bit more academic background on it.

[Christa]

So, anyone got any ideas regarding the questions?

 

Or do they simply seem even more vapid than my normal queries?

[陳德聰]

As usual, to complicate matters:

 

Why does 家 also take on the extended meaning of just being a person as in 專家 or 作家?

 

I think the shuowen says something wrong about the etymology of the character (but I have not the tools to know definitively) so that’s unfortunate, but it’s definitely a roof over a pig.

 

Is the pig ceremonial? Is the pig domesticated livestock? Does the “social gathering place” sense of the measure word feel like a natural extension of the “home” meaning and then does the inclusion of 公司 in the noun class feel like it follows a similar internal logic?

 

I think I have long ago accepted that the noun classes don’t actually follow a particularly strict logic and over time feel more arbitrary than not.

[Christa]

1 hour ago, 陳德聰 said:

As usual, to complicate matters:

 

Why does 家 also take on the extended meaning of just being a person as in 專家 or 作家?

 

I think the shuowen says something wrong about the etymology of the character (but I have not the tools to know definitively) so that’s unfortunate, but it’s definitely a roof over a pig.

 

Is the pig ceremonial? Is the pig domesticated livestock? Does the “social gathering place” sense of the measure word feel like a natural extension of the “home” meaning and then does the inclusion of 公司 in the noun class feel like it follows a similar internal logic?

 

I think I have long ago accepted that the noun classes don’t actually follow a particularly strict logic and over time feel more arbitrary than not.

 

This makes a lot of sense.

 

I think there is some logic here but just not the kind of neat, OCD answer I would like.

 

Back to therapy...

[imron]

7 hours ago, 陳德聰 said:

I think the shuowen says something wrong about the etymology of the character (but I have not the tools to know definitively)

If only there was a dictionary or resource that could show us these things...