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Khaoula

Documents stolen by company

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Khaoula

Hello, what would yo do if you find out your previous employer in China stole your original copy of your bachelor's degree? Can you take any legal actions against them?

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DavyJonesLocker

I'd make a huge fuss until you got it back. Turn up everyday and they will give it back to you to get rid of you. 

People like to think rational and polite conversation is always the  best option. 

 

A bit of yelling and screaming also gets results. 

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roddy

You´re going to need to tell us more. Are you still in China? In the same city? What are they doing with the documents? Etc. 

 

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Khaoula

@roddy I am back in Morocco now. I put my documents in my computer case which I did not expect they'd dare to open and search. I open the case to find it and cannot find it but other documents the certificate was with. An agent they work with told me that they don't want me to be back to China since I did not want to renew my contract with them. I guess that explains why they stole it from me. 

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roddy

First thing to do is get your certificate re-issued. If you're not in China, and you don't have any proof they took it, there's not much you can do. And to be honest, even if you were in China, you say they stole it, they say you lost it - there's not much the police could do. 

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Khaoula

@roddy I have a scanned version of my certificate. I hope it is sufficient to apply for a new work permit in China! As @DavyJonesLocker said, I will just threaten I'd come to the company and cause a scene if they refuse to hand it back.. 

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889

This is a real conundrum. If they did indeed take it out from your case, they cannot possibly admit they did so by returning it. It's impossible.

 

You need to give this a lot of thought and find a way the document can be returned without implicating the school. You probably need to use an intermediary and probably need to come up with some sort of cover, like insisting you must have left it somewhere around the school, maybe they can find it. But loudly claiming it was stolen will get you nowhere.

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Khaoula

@889 I did at the beginning claim that it must be somewhere at the center and they denied they have it 3 times when I know they do have it. I never lost my certificate. They used it to apply for my work permit two years ago

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roddy

Is it possible to get the certificate reissued by the university?

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Khaoula

@roddy A caption on my certificate says that the university won't issue a duplicate copy. However, other people did ask for a "duplicata" and received it. If my employer asks for the original copy then I have no choice but to ask my university for another one... 

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889

Well, they must have given it back to you at some point and maybe it fell behind a wardrobe, things happen.

 

My point, which does not seem to be getting through, is that it is a complete dead-end to deal with the school as if they have done something wrong. If you want to preserve any chance at all of getting this back, you need to ask for help on the basis that you must have foolishly left it behind somewhere. Under the circumstances of course you don't want to do that, but this is China and if you want your diploma back you're going to have to go at this in the Chinese way. (And as I said, that also means dealing with the school through an intermediary.)

 

Obviously you plan to spend a lot more time in China, so learning how to get things done Chinese-style is very good experience.

 

(If you have already made absolutely clear to the school that you think they stole your diploma, though, then it may be too late to salvage anything.)

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roddy

You’re going to need it sometime, I’d just get it now. Unless it’s completely unaffordable. 

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Khaoula

@889 I am certain that they have it. As an agent said before, the boss is trying to prevent me from staying in China so I do not work for anyone else but her. I will just keep insisting. I tried being nice and civilized. It did not work. They even asked me to search my computer case. How did they even know it was there... @roddy I have to try; I hope a scanned version of it would be sufficient

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Shelley

I would suggest you look through all your paperwork, in books, again thoroughly in your computer case, down the back of the desk or similar, basically everywhere.

 

Look in a calm, organized way, and don't assume it isn't in there because you already looked or it wouldn't be in there, just look.

 

You would be surprised the amount of times it is in your possession you just need to look methodically for it.

 

I hope you find, if not get the ball rolling on getting a duplicate asap and keep it safe.

 

I agree that it is probably a lost cause cause to get the school to return it, maybe they have lost it and didn't want to admit it to you so hope you wouldn't notice till you were too far away to do anything about it. If you accuse them of stealing it they are just going to close ranks and ignore you or similar, they can't afford to lose face. 

 

Why does your boss care if you work for anyone else? If it to do with commercial secrets, then you should have signed a non disclosure agreement and if you share information he can sue you or worse for breaking the agreement so he is probably confident you won't.

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Khaoula
Spoiler

 

@Shelley Trust me, I did look for it multiple times with the help with a friend. The boss told me if I do not renew my contract with her, she will make sure I do not stay in the same city. She told me she'd pay me the rest of my money and give me my passport back only if I do not contact her clients and do not tell them about my new work place. I can expect anything malicious from this woman including stealing my certificate to prevent me from going back to China with a proper work visa

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mungouk
12 minutes ago, Khaoula said:

give me my passport back

 

They're holding your passport?  

 

I never even handed over my original degree certificates... there's a process for getting copies certified and "legalised" which means the employer shouldn't need to touch them.  

 

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Khaoula

@mungouk No they handed back all of my documents but not my bachelor's degree certificate. They had to give me back my passport because I knew they had it to apply for a visa renewal 

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DavyJonesLocker

Do you have a scanned copy? 

 

If all else fails there is always the university of PDF and a printing shop ( 图文).

Wouldnt bother in the slightest doing that given the circumstances.

 

 

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DavyJonesLocker
9 hours ago, DavyJonesLocker said:

Wouldnt bother in the slightest doing that given the circumstances.

 

@Khaoula I think I was a bit unclear . I meant to write. 

 

"It wouldnt bother me in the slightest reprinting my own certificate that given the circumstances. " Depends on how elaborate the original was and probably a last resort action. However you may not be comfortable doing that. 

 

I'm a bit too old and too experienced to know that doing things by the book is not always the best option. 😶

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