Coronavirus - those in China, and general discussion

[Jan Finster]

22 minutes ago, ChTTay said:

nless they come from a “severely affected country”.

I guess they consider Germany to be such a country. 

 

[ChTTay]

According to the department of foreign affairs so far it’s Republic of Korea, Italy, Iran, and Japan. 
 

Could be that Germany’s site isn’t up to date yet (originally everyone from abroad was expected to quarantine) or they just assume advising people to expect a quarantine is safer. 

[Jan Finster]

5 hours ago, ChTTay said:

Could be that Germany’s site isn’t up to date yet (originally everyone from abroad was expected to quarantine) or they just assume advising people to expect a quarantine is safer. 

Since Germany now has more cases than Japan, it is going to be problematic no matter what the website says. Maybe the German government updates its website faster than the Chinese (?)

 

What is it like in Taiwan at the moment. How are you treated if you were to visit a language school in Taipei and you traveled from Italy, Germany or elsewhere in Europe. Quarantine? Face masks 24/7? etc?

[imron]

Taiwan appears to be handling it pretty well (see for example here and here).  SARS left a pretty big scar on the Taiwanese psyche, and they moved pretty quickly to make sure the coronavirus wouldn't have a similar impact.

[ChTTay]

9 hours ago, Jan Finster said:

Maybe the German government updates its website faster than the Chinese

Maybe. 
 

Following some of the US stories coming out and various twitter posts that have got a lot of coverage. It hasn’t been looking good in terms of preparedness. Trump coming out with “hunch” that the mortality rate is lower than the WHO’s stated percentage was also bizarre.  
 

Meanwhile in China...  

Recently Beijing have advised teachers and students abroad NOT to come back until a return date is announced. Most people I know abroad are also really concerned about flying in and being unlucky enough to get quarantined in a hotel for 14 days. 
 

Even though virus figures here are showing 0 or close to 0 new cases, my apartment complex got stricter by checking everyone in and out. Before just if you wanted to go in. I did ask why they’re suddenly checking my apartment pass as I leave... I was told I have good Chinese and thank you. ? 

[ChTTay]

Those entering China now fill out a Health Declaration Form...

 

https://www.thebeijinger.com/blog/2020/03/06/flying-beijing-heres-what-you-can-expect

 

[Jan Finster]

7 hours ago, ChTTay said:

Even though virus figures here are showing 0 or close to 0 new cases, my apartment complex got stricter by checking everyone in and out. Before just if you wanted to go in. I did ask why they’re suddenly checking my apartment pass as I leave... I was told I have good Chinese and thank you

 

China is probably going to be very strict regarding foreigners entering China. Even though there are currently hardly any new cases, new outbreaks are possible at any time. While the quarantine has prevented more widespread infections in China, it also means that not everyone in China has been exposed to the virus and is now immune. As I see the situation in Germany at the moment, virutally everyone will be exposed to the virus sooner or later and will either have died or have become immune ("herd immunity"). I could imagine due to the quarantine efforts in China, there is no such herd imnunity in China.  

[ChTTay]

34 minutes ago, Jan Finster said:

China is probably going to be very strict regarding foreigners entering China

What does that have to do with me entering my apartment building in Beijing though? They check everyone. 
 

Im honestly wondering why you quoted that bit ? Not just being awkward.

 

It does look that way what with asking those abroad not to come back yet. From what I’ve read mostly to avoid people bringing the virus back with them and pushing the numbers back up. However, it seems likely to be a global trend of being quite strict with anyone entering your country. 

[Shelley]

2 minutes ago, ChTTay said:

Im honestly wondering why you quoted that bit

 

Possibly misunderstood where you were coming and going from?

[Jan Finster]

42 minutes ago, ChTTay said:

Im honestly wondering why you quoted that bit ? Not just being awkward

I don't know either.. ? Sorry!

[Monty Keys]

22 hours ago, ChTTay said:

Even though virus figures here are showing 0 or close to 0 new cases, my apartment complex got stricter by checking everyone in and out. Before just if you wanted to go in. I did ask why they’re suddenly checking my apartment pass as I leave... I was told I have good Chinese and thank you. ? 

Same thing happened to me......Thought the guard was just new to the job and I was being singled out as the only foreigner. However, everyone was being made to show their pass, especially those who tried to ignore the request and just walk out....?

[StChris]

It's now been two whole weeks without any new confirmed cases in Harbin (I believe there has been one in the province as a whole), so now everyone is eagerly awaiting news of when the restrictions on movement will be lifted. As of now, everything except supermarkets, factories etc are still shut, and registration is still required every time you leave or enter your 小区. I personally think they will be lifted by the end of this week, although my teacher isn't so optimistic. I'm not the only one keen to move on and get back to normal, as this photo I took from my apartment window just over a week ago shows:

 

 

the top line reads 开学啦, and the second begins 三年... - any guesses what the rest is (I had something else to attend and see what she wrote - it was covered in snow by the time I had a chance to look again).

 

Things already seem more relaxed, and more people are out and about in my apartment gardens. I almost got run over by two kids riding their bikes yesterday, which would normally be annoying, but this time I was just happy to see parents relaxed enough to let their children outside now (in fact, I don't normally see kids out riding bikes - I guess the disruption to the school term has its benefits, for the overworked kids anyway). I've also started to hear the odd honk from the nearby road, a sure sign that traffic is slowly returning too. After some snowstorms the week before, the temperature have been getting warmer and walking outside today t really felt that spring was coming. I had a small fit of sneezing just as I got home, which I assume to be hay fever, but could also mean that I might be the one to break Harbin's 14 day long no-virus chain! 

 

A friend in 广州 said that some restaurants have already opened there, albeit with restricted opening hours. While I like cooking, I can't wait to be able to eat out again as normal.

 

哈尔滨的曙光即将来临！

[889]

The Guardian of course has a different view.

 

"'The new normal': China's excessive coronavirus public monitoring could be here to stay."

 

(To be fair, this is obviously one of those stories that reflects a "journalist" with a thesis who then gets quotes supporting that thesis.)

[大块头]

@StChris Ha, reminds me of when a high school friend got to school an hour early so he could tramp out "MR G SMELLS" across the athletic field... "Mr. G" was the math teacher with a classroom on the third floor that overlooked the field.

[Jan Finster]

After snubbing China's management of COVID-19, now the WHO and western specialists laud China's rapid response.

Today, a top German virologist was asked about his opinion of China's management of COVID-19. He said the quarantine was really successful and a good idea. It has not prevented a global pandemic, but it has slowed down the spread and bought the rest of the world some time. He also acknowledged that a quarantine is virtually impossible to implement in the west, because people in the west are way more egoistical.  Nobody in the west wants to cancel soccer games...  ? 

He believes China cannot maintain the quarantine forever as it damages the economy too much. He believes that once the quarantine is over, there will be lots of new cases in China again...

[wibr]

I wouldn't really call the response by the Chinese government rapid. Only after the situation in Wuhan went completely out of control they started to implement effective measures. If they would have listened to the doctors who tried to draw attention to this early on, instead of punishing them, they might have been able to actually contain the virus, or least buy more time.

[dtcamero]

i appreciate this argument, that they didn’t act fast enough and suppressed information, allowing it to spread. but it was the run-up to lunar new year festivities across the country, who has the balls to pull the plug on all of that until you’re really sure that the problem is serious? i think it’s understandable why they waited.

 

arresting whistleblowers like Dr. Li is never acceptable, but unfortunately it’s kinda standard practice in china for a variety of other unrelated problems also.

 

we would like to say that the chinese were slow to respond, and look how western governments displayed effective responses (they certainly had enough time to prepare)... and yet they have done equally poor jobs also. in america hospitals didn’t even get testing kits until the virus had already infected tens/hundreds of people in every major city

 

plenty of blame and to go around. ineffective government responses to the virus seem to be the rule rather than the communist exception.

[Jan Finster]

1 hour ago, wibr said:

Only after the situation in Wuhan went completely out of control they started to implement effective measures.

 

That is difficult to say. There may not have been one patient zero, but possibly hundreds of people got infected at the market independently. With an incubation period of 14 days and given the fact that the common flu is much more common, no one really thinks about coronavirus in the first place. The whistle-blow was on 30th December and the quarantine started only 3 weeks later (23rd January). Italy's response including implementation of a quarantine was not any faster even though they were "warned" by the example of China. The future will tell how long other countries "wait" until they implement such measures...

 

25 minutes ago, dtcamero said:

look how western governments displayed effective responses (they certainly had enough time to prepare)... and yet they have done equally poor jobs also. in america hospitals didn’t even get testing kits until the virus had already infected tens/hundreds of people in every major city

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/02/whistle-blower-aiding-coronavirus-evacuees-lacked-gear-200228182320295.html

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/feb/28/whistleblower-coronavirus-us-untrained-unprotected

 

 

[Dawei3]

On 3/4/2020 at 10:15 AM, Jan Finster said:

wonder why the death rate in South Korea is so much lower

South Korean is testing the more people/population than any other country outside China.   

 

As a result, Korea identifies many more mild cases and as a result, the death rate looks lower.  In contrast, countries like the US are testing very few, so many cases are missed.  Italy likely is missing many as well.    

 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/coronavirus-cases/

[Lu]

5 hours ago, Jan Finster said:

He also acknowledged that a quarantine is virtually impossible to implement in the west, because people in the west are way more egoistical.  Nobody in the west wants to cancel soccer games...

 

3 hours ago, dtcamero said:

but it was the run-up to lunar new year festivities across the country, who has the balls to pull the plug on all of that until you’re really sure that the problem is serious? i think it’s understandable why they waited.

 

The West won't cancel soccer games. China won't cancel the New Year.

 

I don't have a broader point, these two lines just struck me.