Refusing to speak english: success rate

[md1101]

I'm heading to China at the beginning of next year to visit some friends I made from the last time I was there and of course to get some practise with my Chinese again.

Ideally I'd like to speak ONLY Chinese. I've tried it before though and have always failed pretty miserably since it's very impractical when with fellow foreign friends!

So my question is: how successful have people here been in refusing to speak English in order to improve their Chinese? Has anyone managed to go on sticking only to Chinese for more than just a few days? I think my record was one whole morning.

[Senzhi]

I try to do that all the time.

I usually avoid going out too much with my fellow friends, else I might as well have stayed in Europe.

Trying to speak constantly Chinese with my students is another piece of cake though: for the same reason as I want to practice my Chinese, they will complain quickly if I don't speak English.

So for me, the opportunities are the people on the streets, the genuine friends and their families.

So let us say, I'm professionaly forced to speak English about 70% of my time.

Sleeping not included!

[md1101]

haha fair enough. i suppose a lot of people teaching english in china will have that problem of having to speak english as part of their profession! I think it must be a really large hindrance to learning chinese though. maybe ideally i need to find a cold remote mountain top somewhere and live with some monks for a while (whom all speak putonghua of course)....

[dalaowai]

I've been pretty lucky in regards to being able to only speak in Chinese.

My best friend is from Dongbei and doesn't speak English. I live with my wife's family and they don't speak English.

As for Chinese friends, most of them respect that I want to improve my Chinese. As for people who don't want to let me speak Chinese, I speak to them with an incomprehensible french accent until they give up trying to speak to me in English. haha

[md1101]

I speak to them with an incomprehensible french accent

lol... i've thought of doing that before but i just feel too bad about it! plus im slightly worried they'll hear my aussie accent later on. but i guess if i was speaking english later it would defeat the purpose of trying to only speak chinese anyway..

[muyongshi]

When I meet people for the first time even if they start in English and I respond with a few words of English within the first 2 minutes I slip into Chinese just so as to get the "oh your chinese is so good" crap out of the way. And then I just continue even if they are using English. They usually get so frustrated that by the ten minute mark they are only using Chinese. And then I do the same...just be pig headed about using Chinese and never outright agree to help someone improve their english and you will get enough practice in. I don't see any reason to not ever speak any english....

[carlo]

I've been living here for a few years and my English has been deteriorating rapidly. I still get chances to speak it at work (not all the time) but several days can go by without any language other than Chinese. English is not my first language, but it used to be pretty good at one point. The upside obviously is that my Chinese has improved a lot.

As to speaking Chinese with foreign friends, I only know a couple of people who like Chinese so much that they would speak Chinese with me. Maybe I should hang out more with langauge students. As to Chinese learning English, I never made up my mind whether it is better for both to practice a second language together, or simply switch to Chinese, which is often more practical anyway.

[dalaowai]

The other day I was at a burger joint in Shanghai and I placed my order in Chinese. The waitress just looked back at me with a blank stare and said "Sir, do you speak English?" and at that point I lost it, yelled at the waitress for embarassing me in front of my friends, told her that this was racial discrimination and blah blah blah.

She tells me to wait a moment and gets another waitress to take my order. I place my order and the new waitress magically understands everything that I said. So I ask this waitress, "hey what's up with the first waitress, why did she refuse to speak to me in Chinese?" the waitress replies, "Oh, she's not Chinese, she's from the Philippines, she doesn't speak Mandarin."

I was like..."aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh....that's why." Then I ate my burger feeling like a jerk. It was delicious!

So you may find yourself in situations where some waitresses/hotel staff don't speak Chinese!

[gougou]

Then I ate my burger feeling like a jerk.

Rightly so. If you'd have given her 5 more seconds of your time, you would have understood what the problem was without making a big scene. Also, why do you think that this was embarrassing you in front of your friends? Don't they know you speak Chinese?

I prefer to speak Chinese to Chinese as well, but unless I make a trip to Wangfujing, there's not too many people that are desperate to practice their English with me. Many of the people I've met were just as happy to talk to me in Chinese.

Also, I think that having the opportunity to speak Chinese 24 hours a day, it don't think it's a big deal to take a few minutes every now and then to talk in English to someone who doesn't get much opportunities to practice it, such as a taxi driver. Or to a nurse in Chengdu, like I did recently: I don't think my Chinese got any worse in the few minutes we were talking, but it sure made her day.

[md1101]

Oh, she's not Chinese, she's from the Philippines, she doesn't speak Mandarin.

now that would be very embarassing! the same thing has happened to me before actually but i just gave in and spoke english.. then later i could tell by her accent she was phillipino anyway. STILL though... i guess she could have just told you that she's phillipino and doesn't speak Chinese. would have saved a lot of embarassment! it's possible she gets that so many times though (including from every chinese customer) that shes sick of dealing with it.

you're not talking about malones by the way are you?

[md1101]

don't think it's a big deal to take a few minutes every now and then to talk in English to someone who doesn't get much opportunities to practice it

I guess the real challenge is giving up your foreign friends so you don't spend most of your time speaking English OR making some kind of speak chinese only pact (which never works of course and is not possible with a lot of ppl..)

[gougou]

I guess the real challenge is giving up your foreign friends so you don't spend most of your time speaking English

I didn't come here as a student, so I never was surrounded by too many foreigners. Guess that makes it a lot easier!

[dalaowai]

I was at City Diner when that happened. I still don't understand why they feel the need to hire waiters that don't speak Chinese in China. It's pretty ridiculous. This hurts the Chinese language, as it provides an easy way out for foreigners living in China not wanting to make the effort to learn Chinese.

Nevertheless, I think that it's unfair to be discriminated due to the colour of your skin, that's all. Everytime I get off a plane, the flight attendants always say "再见” to everyone else except for the non-asian looking people. They always say "goodbye".

I'd love to see the reaction of Chinese living abroad having people say "Konnichiwa or Annyong" just because they're Asian. There would be an outroar.

[gougou]

I still don't understand why they feel the need to hire waiters that don't speak Chinese in China. It's pretty ridiculous.

Completely agree with that.

Everytime I get off a plane, the flight attendants always say "再见” to everyone else except for the non-asian looking people. They always say "goodbye".

I'm not a fan of that either, but they're just trying to be nice. Most of the foreigners on Chinese planes don't understand Chinese, so it's a nice gesture to talk to them in a language they (most likely) understand. Also, when you say 再见 in return, you will get a 再见 from them as well, try it!

[Lu]

The trick is to make Chinese friends, and speak Chinese to them. The trick is not yelling at waitresses and getting annoyed with airplane staff for speaking a little bit of English to you.

The airplane people, like gougou says, are just being nice by speaking the language the foreigner is more likely to understand. A waste of time to get upset by this. The people in restaurants and the like, and the one-in-a-hundred taxi driver who desperately want to practice their English: humor them. They are not trying to be annoying, they either want to make you feel welcome by speaking your language, or they want to improve their English, and are thus pretty much in the same situation as the foreigner learning Chinese, except with much, much less opportunity for practice. It doesn't really cost anything to chat with them in English for a bit.

So just make Chinese friends, of the kind that don't mind speaking Chinese with you. Of course you need a certain level of Chinese for this, and/or patient friends. But you will likely spend much more time talking with them than with airport staff or waitresses, and so you'll have plenty of opportunity to practice.

[dalaowai]

The trick is to come to China and speak Chinese buddy. It's discrimination and it's unfair.

I know some Iranians in China that absolutely hate it when people great them in Arabic. I know some Dutch who absolutely dislike it when people speak to them in German. I know some Slovakians who cringe if someone speaks to them in Russian.

Some people are proud of their roots and don't necessarily want to be associated to a certain language, that's all. The Chinese government worked hard to implement Mandarin as being the national language.

[gougou]

I know some Iranians in China that absolutely hate it when people great them in Arabic. I know some Dutch who absolutely dislike it when people speak to them in German. I know some Slovakians who cringe if someone speaks to them in Russian.

Do you happen to know any Filipinas that don't like to be addressed in Chinese?

Seriously, though, you should accept that as a foreigner in China, you will never be completely integrated. That's the price we have to pay for living in a country so exciting and different as China.

[dalaowai]

haha, good one Gougou. Agreed! but you have to admit, it's pretty out of place that a non-speaking Chinese waitress was working at a restaurant. I guess that if I was at McDonald's in the States and saw a Caucasian guy working there, I might assume that he speaks English, but he might not...

I know that I'll never be fully integrated into Chinese society and it really saddens me. Why is it that a foreigner can live a few years in another country (i.e. Germany, England, France, Canada, US, Australia, etc) and proudly call themselves a citizen of that country? I guess that after living here for almost five years, I was expecting some kind of normalcy and social acceptance in my daily life.

[gougou]

but you have to admit, it's pretty out of place that a non-speaking Chinese waitress was working at a restaurant.

See above.

[adrianlondon]

I talk in Mandarin to the (primarily malaysian) staff in my local chinese cafe. Well, until I run out of vocab, which happens pretty quickly. Luckily, they don't post on english-forums.com about what a horrible person I am, not speaking English with them ;)

At least I don't think they do ...