billiardsmike Posted October 11, 2006 at 06:48 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 06:48 AM Other than major items, I've never worried about the laowai tax. Who has the time to argue about a couple of kuai on a meal? I was slapped upside the head and my rage awakened today, though. As I left a restaurant I frequently visit, a stand-in bicycle guard approached. I asked how much and he looked like he had palsey. His fingers kept shaking, alternately showing different amounts until he figured the laowai was good for four kuai. I've always paid three without thinking, but now I'm pissed. Can you just blow these guys off when called for? Is there an acceptable range of costs? I've paid everything from 5 mao to 3 kuai. I couldn't care less about the money. It's the principle. I'm not going to make this my life's work, regardless of the thread title; it's not worth the time. I just want to know what's fair. I shouted at the guy, gave him three and left. He didn't argue. It probably should have been even less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiley Posted October 11, 2006 at 07:33 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 07:33 AM My understanding is that for short term bike parking anything higher that 2 mao is highway robbery.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gougou Posted October 11, 2006 at 08:14 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 08:14 AM Who has the time to argue about a couple of kuai on a meal?So you're saying you also pay more on meals? I don't think I ever had that (except for that one guanbing vendor that wouldn't sell to me at the regular price).BTW, in times of religious tension as the ones we currently live in you might want to be more 'politically correct' about choosing thread titles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiardsmike Posted October 11, 2006 at 08:28 AM Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 08:28 AM No, I don't know that I pay more for meals. When I've checked, it's always been right. I just don't bother to check very often if it seems in the ballpark. A few kuai doesn't matter to me usually. I was at dinner recently with a group, and they spent 10 minutes dividing the bill to the nearest kuai. That amazes me. You're probably right about the title, but it seems to be used by anyone with a grudge anymore, holy, unholy, justified or not. Overuse diminishes the power of strong words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roddy Posted October 11, 2006 at 08:41 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 08:41 AM here you go. Couple of years ago, but even inflation couldn't account for more than a few fen when you're starting from such a low base . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiardsmike Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:02 AM Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:02 AM Thanks! 2 Mao is a long way from 3 kuai! I can't wait to see a few individuals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adrianlondon Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:22 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:22 AM I usually find something solid to lock my bike to, so don;t use the bike parking areas. I did once, a week or so ago outside Carrefour, and paid either 2 or 3 mao - I forget which. I think it was 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnd Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:28 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:28 AM billiardsmike, seems like you've got your maos and kuais all topsy turvy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gougou Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:32 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 09:32 AM When I've checked, it's always been right.That reminds me of something... Once at Hutong Pizza, we found out that the bill from the cash register (so a printed one, nothing handwritten) added up the individual items incorrectly - the total was 20 kuai more than the sum of the individual items... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heifeng Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:22 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:22 AM Same thing happened at KTV in 京师大厦! somehow 30+ 30 = 65 or something strange like that on computer printed bill.....luckily (or unluckily) my Chinese friends are the kind that won't go down without a argument over even 1 yuan and we got the bill added correctly....(haha have any of you read similar news in Sichuan about an all out argument from a dispute over a KTV bill in which the police force was called in....well that wasn't me, but I can relate...) i thought i got ripped off on some pencil lead once, it cost me 12 yuan. then i bought some that was 1 yuan and literally turned to dust everytime I tried to write....then I thought it was wrong that I boycotted that little stationary store that sold me decent 12 yuan lead....you just have to pick your battles i guess....and enjoy a good b&*(&*7g session once in a while so you don't just explode at someone on the street. Sure we understand why you are near insane, but the Chinese bystanders will probably just be amused by your frustration.... (are you sure they didn't add a extra automatic charge for a TIP which places tend to do where there are many a foreigners....) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yonitabonita Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:27 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:27 AM I ride just about everywhere and have never paid more than 2 mao. I think 3 kuai is way too much. I always check my bill because by some funny coincidence, whenever the bill has been tallied incorrectly, it's always to my disadvantage. And always, when it happens, I'm with someone white and we've been speaking English at the table. I'm not cool with the laowai tax. Mainly because I don't like being singled out disadvantageously for characteristics I can do nothing to change. This applies across the board, whether at a restaurant, paying for my bike parking, or getting a bottle of water. A restaurant I tried recently was pretty good so I decided to return with my white husband. When I went the first time, I was given the usual chopsticks - I was with someone Chinese. When I appeared with white boy the second time, the restaurant staff wheeled out the 'special chopsticks' that come pre-wrapped and incur an additional charge. This would be ok if they asked me first, and pointed out that for an additional miniscule charge, I could purchase this extra hygenic service. But they didn't. I don't like the presumption that I have hoards of money and I willingly spend without caring. I don't like others deciding how to spend my money on my behalf. I think that whenever a foreigner thinks "I won't check, it's just a couple of kuai", it contributes towards the false 'laowai economy' which is responsible for the disgruntlement of the OP. It also perpetuates the "laowais have money to burn" sort of mentality which is of course bad for the sucker that has to pay more. At a larger scale, the mentality is bad for the reputations of Chinese people, and bad for relationships with Chinese people. People who are already prone to over-generalisations will have all the more cause to accuse the Chinese of being terrible rip off merchants that can't be trusted etc. I think that places where we find "I won't check it's just a couple of kuai' en masse are generally horrid places to be. Think - a good proportion of touristy places. I know that one of the main reasons I avoid lots of touristy places is because far too many laowais before me were relaxed with their money. They drove prices up, and before too long, you have tourist traps. Anyway, getting back to the point, I've learnt to ask for the free chopsticks that everyone else uses. It's only a 2 kuai difference. And while others might not have time to argue about 2 kuai, I have quite a bit of time to argue about matters of principle. yonita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heifeng Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:32 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:32 AM Anyway, getting back to the point, I've learnt to ask for the free chopsticks that everyone else uses. It's only a 2 kuai difference. And while others might not have time to argue about 2 kuai, I have quite a bit of time to argue about matters of principle. HEY! I wrote this in the Chinese Scam sections a few months ago, then people said it doesn't constitute a scam, but I still think it does since I'm pretty sure it's just a scam to make more money, rather than hygienic purposes (cuz in China hygiene's such a huge concern right....). Travel with your own chopsticks (keep pens in your purse, why not chopsticks too)! Sometimes they claim they don't have 'other' chopsticks......which makes me want to drive those 1 yuan chopsticks through their........ ok, once again picking battles....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HashiriKata Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:43 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 10:43 AM Sure we understand why you are near insane, but the Chinese bystanders will probably just be amused by your frustration....Wise words, heifeng! I shouted at the guy, gave him three and left. He didn't argue.I can visualize the scene and it isn't untypical. Here in the West, Chinese guys get cheated too but I dread to think of the consequences to them if they react the way billiardsmike does !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gougou Posted October 11, 2006 at 11:09 AM Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 11:09 AM are you sure they didn't add a extra automatic charge for a TIP which places tend to do where there are many a foreigners....If they did, I'd have appreciated them mentioning it somewhere. But the staff corrected the sum, so I guess it was a mistake (not wanting to imply intent...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiardsmike Posted October 11, 2006 at 12:20 PM Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 12:20 PM You're right on the button Yonita. I avoid large tourist joints like the plague. I tend to frequent the same 6-7 mom/pop joints. The food is better, cheaper and I'm treated like a regular. I don't mean to imply that I don't care if I get ripped off. It's just that with these people, I will believe it's a mistake, so my mind is at ease checking the bill infrequently. When I have, it's always been right. A couple of them actually ran after me when I left too much money, before I understood numbers well. Until today, that was pretty much my outlook here in general, until the blatant white tax. I wouldn't have caught on then, except the guy was a stand-in and not sure how to rip me off smoothly. It took me out of my happy place and put me right back in the real world. Sigh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiardsmike Posted October 11, 2006 at 12:27 PM Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2006 at 12:27 PM Yeah, maybe I over-reacted a little. I was already having a bad-China day, frustrated with the Eastern-style teaching methods, and some guy rips me off, bursting the one little happy bubble I had left. It happens rarely, and I know I'm not helping matters, but I'm certainly not going to apologize either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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