Trouble 'at mill - Evil Landlord

[David W Jackson]

I moved into a new place near San Yuan Qiao where I work. The landlord said it was nice and quiet; unfortunately, due to a combination of poor construction quality and a night-owl neighbour who insists on wearing hard-heel shoes, dragging furniture around all night and banging doors, I can't sleep and am close to doing a "Shining" mad axeman. Last night after talking with her again the landlord decided the problem was neither the building or the neighbour but my "high standard". I pointed out to him the clause I had added to the contract which he had freely signed which clearly states that if the tenant is disturbed by noise he may quit the flat and the landlord must pay back the deposit. He no longer wants to honour that part insisting instead that I stay on for a fortnight since he's "suffered financial loss". I pointed out that I had too and that to hold me responsible for his loss would be as daft as me holding him responsible for mine. This evening there's a pow-wow with the landlord at the agent's. Any thoughts oh wise ones in the dome?

[gougou]

Did you try talking to your neighbor? It's not like it's unheard of in China: in a previous flat I once had my ex-girlfriend over at around 11pm. She was wearing high-heel shoes, and it took about 5 minutes before the old lady from downstairs came knocking on my door. Also, there was the birthday party last month where the people from two (!) floors below had security pay us a visit...

[heifeng]

It seems like it could be worked out between you guys man to man with a friendly knock on the door, or whatever, but if it's getting really messy...technically 噪音 belongs to environmental protection and there are certain standards and regulations so whether or not you are being sensitive or not (what is the decibel level of that noise you say..hehe)I think that your landlord (in an ideal world) has the responsibility to get your neighbor to keep it down a bit....

http://www.sepa.gov.cn/tech/hjbz/bzwb/wlhj/shjzlbz/199403/t19940301_69199.htm

[Luobot]

I can't sleep and am close to doing a "Shining" mad axeman.

Then it's time to leave.

But if you can manage to hold the axe a little longer, then what I would do is to give the landlord (who sounds more helpless than evil) a letter stating the history of the situation, the fact that you have the right to break the lease, per the clause that you mentioned, and that if the situation isn't corrected within a week, that you will exercise your right. Keep a copy of this letter for documentation purposes. Also, speak directly to the person causing the problem. Give her some face, as they say, and explain to her your situation. Meanwhile, look for a new home where you are as certain as death that you will not be disturbed. If the problem isn't corrected by the time you find this place, then give your landlord notice that you're leaving under the terms of your lease and state your demand for the return of any deposit. Keep a copy of this letter, as well. The purpose of this documentation is more for protection against any counter-claims for breaking the lease than because you're actually going to get your deposit back.

Your best bet is to take the tenant who is disturbing you out for lunch ... and leave the axe at home.

Good luck.

[David W Jackson]

Thanks everyone for the ten penneth. Appreciated. I and the landlord have both tried on numerous occasions to talk with the girl but you know some people simply cannot be reasoned with and despite her many - ostensibly - sincere apologies their was no change in her behaviour: coming home at 2 and then banging around until 4pm. So no diplomatic solution and no military one - wielding the imagined axe is not quite my style:) - so I moved out this weekend at much inconvenience and cost. My take is that there is a whole generation of young Chinese who understand all about their rights but nothing about their responsibilites: spoilt, inconsiderate and selfish and aided and abetted in their antisocial behaviour by a one-child policy which encourages indulgent parenting and a system predicated more on expediency and face than notions of right and wrong. What has she learnt from this? It probably confirmed her belief that she can do what wants when she wants with impunity. At the weekend I was scammed out of 500 RMB by an agency. I was looking at a flat and was asked to retain it with a deposit. I don't read Hanzi but didn't suspect that there could be a clause saying that if I didn't take the flat I would forfeit the money. There was. I didn't take the flat because they tried to include additional fees which my Chinese girlfriend, who is also in the business but was absent when I signed the chit, assures me are normally included. We called the cops. Not interested of course. So more shitty behaviour. If anyone knows of some way of redress please let me know (I seem to recall there's a phone number for disgruntled foreigners or something). They good news is that I slept like a baby last night in my new pad. The experience leaves a bit of a sour taste though. Do let me have your thoughts. All the best.

[shanghaikai]

You could be right or your could be reading too much into things. Overall, Chinese culture is predicated more upon relativism than absolutes as they may seem to be for western culture. Both have their pros and cons and there are many anthropoligical explanations for the historical adoption of either in any culture.

Since you have a Chinese girlfriend, my recommendation is to ask her to handle much of these things for you. Unless she is a total pushover (and Chinese girls usually are not), you'll probably get things resolved with much less stress and with much more favorable outcomes.

It will likely be a long time before you are so familiar with Chinese and Chinese societal norms that you can handle and resolve major problems successfully so be sure to use your "guanxi" with sympathetic Chinese friends/acquaintances to represent you. While they do so, keep learning from them. As disadvantaged as you will almost always be having a foreign face, Chinese people will still respect a foreigner they don't expect to outwit them in their own language and manueverings. You have a long ways to go before doing that...on your own. Use your friends.

[imron]

If anyone knows of some way of redress please let me know (I seem to recall there's a phone number for disgruntled foreigners or something).

Not to sound harsh, but if you sign something you can't read then the fault lies pretty clearly with you, and generally that's how deposits work anyway, not just in real-estate but in most other businesses too.

[cdn_in_bj]

I'm sorry to hear about your experience. I think most people here (both foreigners and locals alike) have been the victims of inconsiderate and selfish acts. I know I've experienced things here which have been annoying, though not enough so to make me want to move.

My take is that there is a whole generation of young Chinese who understand all about their rights but nothing about their responsibilites: spoilt, inconsiderate and selfish and aided and abetted in their antisocial behaviour by a one-child policy which encourages indulgent parenting and a system predicated more on expediency and face than notions of right and wrong. What has she learnt from this? It probably confirmed her belief that she can do what wants when she wants with impunity.

Unfortunately, I have to agree with your analysis. I have especially noticed young children here acting like spoiled brats, talking back to adults and just being rude in general, while their parents just smile or laugh. And I'm generalizing here, but it seems to be worse the better off the family is. These are China's leaders of tomorrow.

At the weekend I was scammed out of 500 RMB by an agency. I was looking at a flat and was asked to retain it with a deposit. I don't read Hanzi but didn't suspect that there could be a clause saying that if I didn't take the flat I would forfeit the money. There was.

I'm afraid that you have yourself to blame for this. Besides, 500 RMB is actually on the low side for a rental deposit.

They good news is that I slept like a baby last night in my new pad. The experience leaves a bit of a sour taste though. Do let me have your thoughts.

And that's the most important thing, right? As for the 500 RMB and "sour taste", just write it off as a learning experience.

[shanghaikai]

Unfortunately, I have to agree with your analysis. I have especially noticed young children here acting like spoiled brats, talking back to adults and just being rude in general, while their parents just smile or laugh. And I'm generalizing here, but it seems to be worse the better off the family is.

That generalization applies to any culture, not just the Chinese.

While I understand the inclination to spoil children in China due to the one-child policy, I also understand that once these children enter the education system, they're treated to a nice dose of humbling reality as they are ultimately measured against their peers.

That said, spoiled brats still annoy the crap out of me and while it isn't my place to tell their parents to do something about it, it is certainly my place not to grant such children the same leniency when they encroach upon my space. I won't necessarily reprimand them, but I'll respectfully express my higher expectations and challenge them to live up to them.

In fact, that's what I do with adults too. If Chinese social culture is to change, there needs to be that intolerable minority that both expects and demands that the whole live up to a higher standard. Some call it cultural imperialism, but there's a difference between forcing someone to observe your culture's holidays and simply expecting them not to spit on your shoes.