Rose?

[Roslyn]

Does anyone know if the characters 薔薇 mean 'rose' (as in the flower) in both Chinese and Japanese? I've been footering about with online dictionaries and the only discrepancy so far is that the Chinese translation comes out 'Rosa'.

I know they probably won't be pronounced the same, it's just the meaning I'm interested in.

[HashiriKata]

Yes, it does mean roses in both languages.

(But I don't think it's pronounced "rosa" in Chinese. Where did you get this info?)

[in_lab]

The genus is rosa. According to wikipedia, the species of 薔薇 is Rosa multiflora.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosa_multiflora

http://zh.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%E8%96%94%E8%96%87&variant=zh-tw

[Roslyn]

@HashiriKata: Oh, no, I know it's not pronounced rosa. The dictionary just translated it as 'rosa'.

@in_lab: That would explain it. I guess they're more similar than the same? Would someone reading it think 'roses' or would they be more likely read it as the genus name, rosa?

[leeyah]

The common name for rose is definitely 玫瑰(花).

But if you look at it etymologically neither of the two characters means 'flower', both characters are names for jade and 瑰 also means magnificent; whereas if you look at the two characters 薔薇 you will see they both have 艹 on top which means plant. 薔薇 is traditionally refers to Chinese rose (which is, like many other Chinese things, often called Japanese in the West )

薔薇属 is the general term for all flowers classified as 'roses'. If you can read Chinese have a read of this:

玫瑰、月季和蔷薇，其实都是蔷薇属植物。在汉语中人们习惯把花朵直径大、单生的品种称为月季，小朵丛生的称为蔷薇，可提炼香精的称玫瑰。但在英语中它们均称为rose。

I don't know much about flowers, but it says the difference is in the petals. And to make things even more complicated, there's also 月季 for Chinese/Japanese rose

My conclusion is: 薔薇 usually refers to Chinese rose & 玫瑰　is more common for what we mean by 'rose' in the West, but, actually, both species are Chinese in origin...

[isela]

This is really informative! Thanks for sharing, Leeyah!

In fact, 月季花 is the "city-flower" of Tianjin. But for all my life I didn't know it's actually Rose (well.. at least in the western terminology). On my defense, 月季 are all such big flowers that you simply don't identify them with 玫瑰, but still, this is a shame.

[leeyah]

In fact, 月季花 is the "city-flower" of Tianjin. But for all my life I didn't know it's actually Rose (well.. at least in the western terminology). On my defense, 月季 are all such big flowers that you simply don't identify them with 玫瑰, but still, this is a shame

Isela, thank you for contributing new information on Tianjin & yes, you're right they just don't look like 'regular' roses - they look such big bunch of petals！ I got curious and baidu-ed for some pictures: 月季花 are really, really beautiful ！

[isela]

Yeah!!!! I am really proud now!!!