Unusual Z visa opportunity-used cars

[jobin]

I will be needing a long term china visa in 2 months. My friend, australian, has been offered a year long Z visa in exchange for 'granting' some agency the right to use his name and passport to import a used car into china. My friend may never see the car, doesn't care. Apparently only foreign high-executive types can import used cars, teachers need not apply. The agency will provide some 'gray' documentation to china govt, get the visa, use the docs to import the car, sell the car....blah blah. If all true, win-win.

I want the same. Does anyone have first hand knowledge of this scheme and the probability of the desired outcome. I have usa passport.

[joshuawbb]

I honestly don't have proper knowledge on such a "scheme", but in my opinion this should be ringing alarm bells all around; it's clearly illegal. As I said, I don't know the details but don't go anywhere near that sort of thing. Giving your passport to anyone non-governmental, official, etc to use your personal details for anything = always a no-no.

Firstly, as far as my knowledge goes there is only one way to get a Z visa, which is to be employed by a legitimate company in China which has the legal right to employ foreigners (companies get this right by some sort of large tax payment to the government, and official registration). The company acts as your sponsor for the visa and should provide necessary documentation such as an invitation letter, etc. As I'm a student in China on an X visa, I don't really have the technical details. A Chinese embassy will authorise and give out the Z visa. As far as I know, applicants for an X visa also need a degree and a year's working experience at minumum to fit the criteria.

Your friend's offer sounds just like a scam previously brought up: http://www.chinese-forums.com/index.php?/topic/8522-warning-cheated-in-china-again-help&highlight=passport+warning

As you see, the scam victim got his passport back pasted together and probably duplicated for further scams, and didn't get his money share. To me this seems clearly a variation on the above scam, and could both end up with a possibly thieved passport minus said visa. Aside from that, everything you described regarding the procedure and 'gray' documentation is clearly illegal anyway - who and what company would your visa be sponsored by? Does the agency claim it will sponsor for you? The only way of getting an Z visa is the legal way, to be employed and sponsored with a legal company.

Sorry if I sound blunt, I don't mean to be. You should advise your friend to stop what he's doing.

[lordnikon]

I cant say how legit this is but I have been offered this before as well by a friend but at the time i was not looking for a visa so I turned them down. What I was told was that foreigners are allowed to import a single car tax free for personal use in to china. My friend had a family member who owned an import/export business and stated that they could get me a Z visa through the company and in exchange I would let them import the car in my name so they would not have to pay the import tax. The person who told me this had no reason to scam me and only mentioned it after i had mentioned something about getting a visa during a conversation. So this is just my 2 cents about this, take it for what it is worth. It seems to be illegal to do this as it is a way to subvert import taxes so you are taking your own risk by doing this

[abcdefg]

I want the same. Does anyone have first hand knowledge of this scheme and the probability of the desired outcome. I have usa passport.

No first hand knowledge of that sceme, but I'll still offer some unsolicited advice.

What if the car being imported in your name is stopped at the border and found to be packed with cocaine? Kiss the rest of your life goodbye.

And even if it doesn't turn out to be quite that drastic a scenario, have you not heard of identity theft?

I would think lending out your passport for a couple weeks is a supremely bad idea.

[Xiwang]

As tempting as this scheme may be, it should only be used by someone who doesn't ever plan to return to China. At some point, China may start wondering why this "executive" hasn't been paying any income taxes.

[BrandeX]

Whoa! Hold on guys! This is a well known and classic scam here, just like the Nigerians that want to send money to some random westerner to help them transfer it out of the country. Do NOT be a chump, you will end up potentially imprisoned for this one.

[liuzhou]

It's a scam!

[gato]

Sounds like a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to me.

[yialanliu]

Anything to do with a used car is a scam...come on people...seriously?

Selling cars overseas but you pay shipping first...this is just another example.

Z visas are extremely hard to get, and are worth more than a couple used cars.

By the way, if your caught doing this in China, it's a pretty stiff sentence(years in prison) and not like the US embassy can do you much good either since China has yet to listen to the West over their judicial rulings.

[jobin]

Well, i see no first hand replies here, only opinions without knowledge. Not to fault you guys for the opinions but did you ever see the movie 'a river runs through it'? Told about a really great fishing spot; remote , wild and lovely. Until someone told how good it was and then shortly the place was overun with fishermen and casuals both of which soon ruined the place. or something like that, i never saw the movie.

of course, it is possible that this scheme is so good that those who REALLY DO know about it are keeping quiet in order to avoid publicity and public scrutiny. sure we can all visualize the worst, but i am an optimist! or a fool, take your pick. nothing has happened yet, so when my friend gets the visa etc i will either keep my mouth shut or relay the news of the scam. this guy is not a nigerian. and the chinese guy wants to keep his *ss clean too.

[roddy]

It's just too dubious for my liking. Getting a visa via an agency is one thing, getting a visa via an agency AND having a car you've never seen floating around China under your name is just a step too far. It would make me feel uncomfortable to such a degree that I'd rather incur the extra expense and hassle of not doing it. Wouldn't touch it with a bargepole.

Is it an out-and-out scam - not necessarily, it's pretty easy to see where the advantage comes from for all parties. But it's still dodgy.

[imron]

Well, i see no first hand replies here,

Did you read the thread linked to above, which did offer first-hand experience of a variation of the same scheme?

[gougou]

Z visas are extremely hard to get, and are worth more than a couple used cars.

I'll trade mine!

[leeovisa]

How long a visa will you get, 2-year or 1-year residence permit (work visa)?

Right before it expires, HOW will you extend it?

After the company get the used car and earn much more (than you), will they help you again to extend your visa?

If something really bad happens to the company during the car import or later on the car owner, you will definitely suffer.

In short, more risks, less benefit.

[BrandeX]

Well, i see no first hand replies here, only opinions without knowledge.

I read a first hand account once, but i can't find it again sorry. Also, I was referring to common Nigerian scams above, not that this transaction involved them. Anyone who gets involved in this is a... well there is one born every minute.

Anyone who wants can import a car I think, looked into it once because I like older American cars (not allowed here anyway unfortunately) you just need a res permit and lots of cash for the tax iirc.

[benhadad]

if you want first hand experience i will give you the back hand experience. A relative of mine wanted help in importing cars to china and since I speak Chinese to a degree and was living here we looked into this.

He was interested because he sales used cars (high end , BMW, Mercedes, royal Royce etc) and had these Chinese guys buying and shipping the cars to china. These guys were loaded with money and were bragging how they get them in the country. My relative who is an honest guy thought there must be a legitimate business side this.

So in a nut shell these are the options they play

1. set up an RO in China, under this they import property up to a certain amount such as cars for each person in the company.

2. after set time, close RO and liquidate vehicles

3. repeat

[so issue is who to head up this RO?]

find a unsuspecting foreigner who wont stay for more than 1 or 2 years. get his passport, open the company up, import the items, in fact they from what i understand can import lots of them but are suppose to pay tax. So import lots of them , don't pay tax, liquidate cars, close company promise to pay tax, and don't. Hopefully by now the foreigner has return home and the government won't allow them ever to return without paying taxes.

Of course they could pay extra money and do an import/export and do the same thing, along as they have the passport to set the company up, after that point they can assign themselves to control the rest. Then assign all the tax burden on the foreigner who just fled the country (not really fled, you just happened to go back for vacation)

That is just one way it could work. I won't hand out the other possible ways of doing it because they are legal but can be twisted very easily to take advantage of foreigner. Even if done legally there is not much money and high risk.

So after figuring out some possible ways, met with some respected Chinese business individuals. What a big surprise so much for respectable ,in the process did meet with two Chinese people who offered to do this service and I would help collect the foreigner passports and ensure they would leave before the stuffing hit the fan. Of course this was not acceptable and quite disturbing the willingness of such business individuals to be involved.

The other one that I have actually witness is where a long term student allowed use of his visa to import a car for a Chinese friend. When the friend had an accident they were dragged to court because the transfer never went through and they were still listed as the owner of the car. Everything came out ok because they were willing to pay all the taxes and fees but until the court date the foreigner was not allowed to leave the country.

So if it is a good thing it still seems like your getting taken for a ride and suckered out of your share of the profits. The last I checked high end BMW's were going for around $10,000 -20,000 US above cost. Considering the risk and what they are making off you , I would be asking for $5000 US or more plus the Z visa.

[senor boogie woogie]

I would think that the cost of the government license to hire foreign workers would be more than just buying a new car, so this does not make much sense.