youngest legal age to have children in china?

[WestTexas]

Ahh okay that makes sense. Hadn't thought of it in terms of multiple generations having kids over a long period, but yeah, if a typical woman had children at 18 instead of say 30 the total population would be much higher, even if everyone only had 1 child.

[Kobo-Daishi]

Civic94 wrote:

then I told them about spanking and the fact that the parents can go to jail for that..

That reminds me of a news article, I read today at the ABC (American Broadcasting Corporation) TV network's web site, titled "Should Your Child Be Spanked at School? In 19 States, It's Legal".

Snippets from the article:

It is one of the most controversial methods of child discipline, but spanking in school -- usually with a wooden or fiberglass paddle -- is still allowed by law in 19 states. The practice is most prevalent in the Midwest and South. According to a report from the Juvenile Information Exchange, more than 28,500 students in Georgia were spanked in 2008, mostly in rural counties. The number is much smaller in Florida -- around 3,600 last year -- but that's where the issue is getting new attention.

For the second year in a row, NPR reported, a Florida lawmaker is trying to ban corporal punishment in schools there; last year the measure never made it to the floor for a full vote.

Opponents of the ban say spanking is matter of tradition and good old-fashioned discipline. But at least one Florida mom is suing to stop the practice. Tenika Jones says the principal at the Joyce Bullock Elementary School in Levy County paddled her 5-year-old so severely last April that he cried for hours, triggering an asthma attack, which in turn required a trip to the emergency room.

-----

States That Allow Spanking (Source: Center for Effective Discipline) Alabama Arizona Arkansas Colorado Florida Georgia Idaho Indiana Kansas Kentucky Louisiana Mississippi Missouri North Carolina Oklahoma South Carolina Tennessee Texas Wyoming

http://abcnews.go.co...ory?id=15932135

The article doesn't say whether it's legal for parents to spank their children but apparently it's okay for school administrators at some US schools.

What's that old saying?

Spare the rod and spoil the child?

http://www.phrases.o...ngs/328950.html

It seems that the idea behind it came from the Bible.

So smack those brats around.

Kobo.

[Kobo-Daishi]

Civic94 wrote:

I told them that I can speak fluent cantonese, which is really good since many ABC's cant speak anything but english.

Civic94 wrote:

hey 大肚男

Speaking of Cantonese, shouldn't that be 大肚腩 rather than 大肚男?

http://www.cantonese...ry/words/14060/

I'm not really up on my Cantonese so if I'm missing some clever punny thing...

Kind of like the Beatles company Apple Corps. A pun on "apple core".

Kobo.

[civic94]

大肚男 is another user, I was replying to his/her post.

does anyone know how to quote people here?

[imron]

With quote tags [ quote ] [ /quote ] or by clicking on the quote button in the reply tool bar (7th icon from the right on the lower bar)

[liuzhou]

I've long been surprised by the number of otherwise intelligent Chinese people who boldly state that everyone in mainland China speaks putonghua. When challenged, they put their brains in gear and remember that they know or have met many people who don't.

In fact, even the Chinese government, which really wants standardisation, admits that only just over 50% of the mainland population is proficient in putonghua.

A total of 53.06 percent of China’s population can “effectively communicate orally in Mandarin,” according to China’s Ministry of Education, which recently conducted a survey of half a million people. The rate in cities was 66 percent, while in rural areas it was 45 percent, the ministry said.

Source

I recall seeing a more recent report, which basically said the same again, but can't trace it at the moment.

[civic94]

Posted by liuzhou

In fact, even the Chinese government, which really wants standardisation, admits that only just over 50% of the mainland population is proficient in putonghua.

My mom told me that when she grew up, even people from the next village over, just about 100 yards, they speak a different dialect. they communicate by writing chinese words or using hand gestures. Oh man I wish I had went to Chinese school or learned mandarin when I was small

[liuzhou]

when she grew up

It's still the same in many places.

[WestTexas]

I've long been surprised by the number of otherwise intelligent Chinese people who boldly state that everyone in mainland China speaks putonghua.

Not that surprising. I've met Chinese who claimed all young Chinese people speak English. I wouldn't consider those few people 'otherwise intelligent' though, I'd consider them delusional.

[skylee]

My mom told me that when she grew up, even people from the next village over, just about 100 yards, they speak a different dialect. they communicate by writing chinese words or using hand gestures. Oh man I wish I had went to Chinese school or learned mandarin when I was small

Cheer up. You can always study English some more.

[liuzhou]

I've met Chinese who claimed all young Chinese people speak English.

Hey! That's nothing.You want delusional?

I've met English teachers who thought they spoke English. Mostly foreigners.

[liuzhou]

To get back to the original point, premarital (and extra marital) sex is technically illegal in China, so the marriage ages are the effective age of consent ages, legally.

Of course this is totally ignored, as are many laws in China.

[liuzhou]

does anyone know how to quote people here?

Yes. All the people who quoted people before you asked the question.

[gato]

You sure about that? Do you have a link? I'd think that if such laws existed before, it would have been abolished by now.

[liuzhou]

You sure about that? Do you have a link?

Here is a link re extra-marital sex being illegal.

http://newyork.china-consulate.org/eng/lsqz/laws/t42222.htm#Chapter I General Provisions

"Cohabitation of a married person with any third party shall be prohibited."

As far as I know, this has never been repealed.

And somewhere on this computer or that one, I have the link to the pre-marital situation. Get back to you!

[gato]

Just looked it up.

There is a so-called 社会抚养费 (social support fee) -- a fine in reality -- for couples who bear children out of wedlock. It's the same fine for married couples who have more than their quota of kids.

The fine is supposed 2 to 6 times the ACTUAL salary for both the man and the women in the previous year. (Is there a loophole for the unemployed kids of well-to-do parents then?)

http://people.rednet...w.asp?ID=426376

根据《湖南省人口与计划生育条例》的规定，符合结婚条件但未办理结婚登记怀孕第一个子女的，应当在子女出生前补办结婚登记和生育证。

非婚生育按照上年度总收入的二至六倍征收项规定标准征收社会抚养费。

上述总收入，按违法生育者或者违法收养者的双方实际收入计算。农村居民的实际收入低于本乡（镇）上年度农村居民人均纯收入，城市居民的实际收入低于本市、县上年度人均可支配收入的，农村居民以本乡（镇）上年度农村居民人均纯收入计算，城市居民以本市、县上年度城镇居民人均可支配收入计算。

因此，如你的小孩尚未出生的话，只需立刻办理结婚并办理生育证则不会受到处罚。

http://www.china.com.../PI-c/92122.htm

《中华人民共和国人口与计划生育法》

第十八条 国家稳定现行生育政策，鼓励公民晚婚晚育，提倡一对夫妻生育一个子女；符合法律、法规规定条件的，可以要求安排生育第二个子女。具体办法由省、自治区、直辖市人民代表大会或者其常务委员会规定。

http://www.people.co...810/796970.html

社会抚养费征收管理办法发布

第五条 不符合人口与计划生育法第十八条规定生育子女的流动人口的社会抚养费的征收，按照下列规定办理：

（一）当事人的生育行为发生在其现居住地的，由现居住地县级人民政府计划生育行政部门按照现居住地的征收标准作出征收决定；

（二）当事人的生育行为发生在其户籍所在地的，由户籍所在地县级人民政府计划生育行政部门按照户籍所在地的征收标准作出征收决定；

（三）当事人的生育行为发生时，其现居住地或者户籍所在地县级人民政府计划生育行政部门均未发现的，此后由首先发现其生育行为的县级人民政府计划生育行政部门按照当地的征收标准作出征收决定。

当事人在一地已经被征收社会抚养费的，在另一地不因同一事实再次被征收社会抚养费。

[yialanliu]

Key thing to note:

The fine is supposed 2 to 6 times the ACTUAL salary for both the man and the women in the previous year. (Is there a loophole for the unemployed kids of well-to-do parents then?)

In China, salary makes a minority of your income. Prior to my dad leaving China, his professor salary made up 10% of his income. My current salary is looking to be between 20-50% of my income depending on the amount of bonus I get. On top of this, living stipend, transportation stipend, kid stipend (all of them real stipends from many companies) amounts to a lot of extra non salary money although its paid with the salary.

On top of this, the number of people living on expense accounts versus salary is huge. Practically everyone driving an S600 makes an official salary of 3k a month if they own the business. It's just so much easier to live off of an expense account since those aren't taxed and china only cares about getting receipts which aren't hard to get either.

So yea, the fine seems huge at first glance, but its not really. And in most places, its a flat fee, not a portion of income. The portion of income was back in the old days when people were tiered pay for their position and everyone got the same amount within the same tier.

[liuzhou]

In China, salary makes a minority of your income.

Sorry, but that is a gross, inaccurate and offensive generalisation. What percentage of Chinese people have "expense accounts"? I'd guess less than 1%.

Do the millions of transient workers have expense accounts? The shop girls? The wait staff in China's millions of restaurants? The guy who fixes my domestic appliances when they break down? The factory workers making your Ipad? The staff in the millions of cell phone shops? The street cleaners and shit shovellers? Or the millions and millions of peasants?

The people doing ordinary jobs?

[gato]

Btw, in addition to the fine, those who work for the government or government-owned companies will usually be fired if they violate the family planning law. That covers a lot of people if you think about all the employees of banks, utilities, transportation companies, schools, etc.

[yialanliu]

Sorry, but that is a gross, inaccurate and offensive generalisation. What percentage of Chinese people have "expense accounts"? I'd guess less than 1%.

Do the millions of transient workers have expense accounts? The shop girls? The wait staff in China's millions of restaurants? The guy who fixes my domestic appliances when they break down? The factory workers making your Ipad? The staff in the millions of cell phone shops? The street cleaners and shit shovellers? Or the millions and millions of peasants?

The people doing ordinary jobs?

Please don't take 2 paragraphs and combine them randomly and distort my meaning. Take each paragraph as a paragraph and an idea!

All workers at my company have stipends that amount to 20% of their pay minimum (assuming they walk to work and are unmarried with no kids and live in company housing) hence why I said my bonus is 20-50% because 20% is a minimum from the stipend. If you live away form the company, take public transportation and have 1 kid, your stipend more than doubles and that means for some workers its 50%+.

To help clarify: The ABOVE Post was about white collar jobs and where I intern right now.

The BELOW applies to blue collar non managerial positions (factor workers, waitresses)

Next, for the people who are factory workers (read: poor and not driving S600s) Many workers in China have room and board along with their salary. The cost of the room and board can be 1k easily and with a 2-3k salary, that's also quite significant. In addition to this, perks may include rail transportation to get home for Chinese New Year, bonuses at that time and during 5/1.

Another Paragraph will begin to explain about expense accounts:

The way expense accounts work in China is very different than in the west. No I was not talking about the super rich exclusively when it comes to some types of expense accounts. Every business in China has an expense account and that means every owner in China is doing exactly this. That actually makes it a much different scope when you think of it that way. This is because in China, what qualifies as expenses are different than in the US. In the US documentation is much more rigid. In China, it doesn't matter as much as long as you have receipts. You don't need to explain it because it is generally accepted that as long as it can be made to work, they'll accept it. It's also why most places have 2 sets of accounts.

^^ To further clarify, in China, you are taxed on a salary and taxed as a corporation (like the US). However, the owners all claim the 3k salary (lower than the required amount to be taxed as a person), then they take all their profits and subtract it by their receipts. These receipts are the grey income the owners are using. There are plenty of 10+ employee companies with a net income of around 50 RMB. (They must keep it above 0 or face penalties, doesn't make sense...but I found it funny). How do you use all that money? You spend it and as long as you get a receipt, its all good. A Rolex watch receipt works just fine as an expense account receipt, saw it first hand.

The reason why I said minority for salary is due to these perks given. For the white collar workers, we get plenty of stipend money. What's great about stipend money for the company is due to the fact of not needing to adjust it upwards due to promotions. What's good for workers is that your salary is much lower and you don't have to pay taxes when your income is too high. (Lots of stipends are just reimbursements after you provide the right receipt). For the blue collar workers, you get your perks as well. While the largest portion is room and board, it's still a perk that needs to be paid for by somebody and I think its fair to take that value and add it on. For your owners, its the worst case.

Do the millions of transient workers have expense accounts? No expense accounts but taken care of

The shop girls? Taken care of

The wait staff in China's millions of restaurants? Taken care of

The guy who fixes my domestic appliances when they break down? He doesn't pay taxes since he normally works cash money. His reported salary is much lower than his income

The factory workers making your Ipad? Taken care of

The staff in the millions of cell phone shops? Taken care of (their bonuses are very high due to most of their income comes from commission)

The street cleaners and shit shovellers? Look at white collars if governmental street cleaners and shit shovellers, or blue collar for the private ones

Or the millions and millions of peasants? Only area where it is hard to explain. Basically, these people's non salary income comes from government subsidies and can vary greatly. Some will get a lot, majority don't. Only area where my explanation doesn't fit the everyone. But then again, majority =/= everyone.

those who work for the government or government-owned companies will usually be fired if they violate the family planning law

Not true anymore. Even in the pasty, it was a select minority (similar to the percentages of 8 month abortions you hear about). Very few were fired, typically, penalties were pay stopped increasing for a few years or you were denied promotions.

Btw, how was I offensive?