Use of 吧

[aristeon]

Hi everyone,

I just read the following sentence:

"父亲叫他休息几天，其实也说不上休息，大白天睡觉吧，睡不着，怎么休息?"

How would you translate "大白天睡觉吧，睡不着" ?

Thanks

[li3wei1]

"Even if you were to go to bed in the day, you couldn't sleep"

[roddy]

Aristeon, if you're going to keep posting these questions could you also have an attempt at trying to answer them yourself as best you can. Thanks.

[skylee]

Take a look at the explanation of Fin. Part. (3) of the word in the Lin Yutang Dictionary -> http://humanum.arts.cuhk.edu.hk/cgi-bin/agrep-lindict?query=%a7%61&category=wholerecord

[aristeon]

@roddy

If I ask a question it's because I don't know the answer. I was very happy to have found a community where people could help me study Chinese.

But I will stop asking questions if I am bothering others.

[imron]

I think roddy's meaning is not that you should stop asking questions, but rather that when you ask your question, you should also mention what conclusions you have already reached and what you think it might mean. That is, let people know your thought process rather than just asking for a direct answer.

[Tiana]

Agreed with imron, by showing your attempts at answering your own questions, you'd help helpers to help you better.

There are many possible answers to a question but without your initial guide, the answers may turn out to be what you already know or way beyond what you're ready to comprehend.

[Arreat]

Hi, aristeon. I'm a Chinese. But I really don't know the meaning of this sentence exactly. Could you also tell us more context around this sentence? Thanks

[aristeon]

Hi everyone,

I understand now what roddy meant, so I'll try to follow your advice when I ask a question next time.

However, Li3wei1's answer was exactly what I was looking for, and so far, I have benefited a lot from other users' answers, that's why I didn't realize my questions were not clear.

[imron]

It's not that the question is unclear, just that when you also state your thought process and current uncertainties 1) it makes the discussion more interesting and 2) it's more useful to people who stumble across this thread in several months/years when trying to solve a similar problem of their own.

Asking "translate this sentence" doesn't provide nearly the same level of discussion.

[aristeon]

@roddy, imron

I don't want to be rude, but I'd like to make this point clear.

I am very annoyed by these constant criticisms on how questions should be made. I don't like when a forum has so many rules and everyone tells others how they have to write questions. This is a forum about China, and in my view if someone doesn't go against any particular rule there should be a certain level of tolerance.

All these endless discussions about how to write a post are to me a waste of time. Every time I write a post there's someone criticizing: either the question is too short, or unclear, or not useful to others. That is a matter of opinion. I don't like too long questions, for example, but I don't say anything because it's just my opinion. I wouldn't even think of bothering other people by telling them how to put their questions.

I was studying Chinese and I asked a question, someone understood it, replied to it, and everything was fine. Now, if you tell me that my point of view isn't compatible with how you run this forum, then I'll find something else.

[OneEye]

I can't speak for anyone else, but in my view, it's roddy's forum. You can use it or not, and it won't greatly affect...well, anything or anyone whatsoever. But if you're going to use it, you ought to use it according to the owner's guidelines. And the owner has asked you to put some more effort into these sorts of things. You can do that or not, but don't expect much help if you don't. People tend to get away with it if they just pop in for a one-off translation, but when you come in and make these sorts of requests regularly without doing what is requested of you in the forum guidelines, other people will tend to get irritated.

[aristeon]

@OneEye

Sure: his house, his rules. And I have already said that I have no problem leaving if that's the policy of this forum.

I don't like when people control too much a discussion and intervene too often when it's not absolutely necessary.

And in my view, they intervene too much on such issues and somehow seem to encourage other users to do the same. I don't see the point in criticizing each other in this way instead of exchanging knowledge and info in a relaxed and easy-going way. I'm not writing a dissertation, and the length of my posts also depends on my time. Besides, I am not a native speaker, so misunderstandings can arise. Users can ask me to clarify, if my question isn't clear, but why do they get so upset about asking? That just doesn't make interacting with people particularly enjoyable. As far as I am concerned, if I see a question that I feel I could answer I don't mind asking if something isn't clear. Until now, people who made remarks about how I write posts were the ones who actually had nothing to say about the topic. That might be a coincidence, of course.

Anyway, what you said is right. The people who use this forum agree with the administrator's point of view. I already use other forums, such as forumosa, which is basically for people living in Taiwan, and for some reason it feels really different there. I guess it's a question of taste...