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三国演义 -Reading a difficult book


rob07

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males generally got their 子 at 20

Typo alert. All of those 子's ...

Apart from Liu Bei, Cao Cao is called 孟德.

Besides ability and motivation, interest is also important. I can read long novels and love many of them, but not this one. I can't even finish watching the TV series. I might one day finish it for the sake of finishing it. But I can't seem to get more interested in this book.

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Also I think that 也=啊 can be fun but then didn't you miss a whole lot?

No, if you look at what the dictionary definitions are saying, for example, the first one says that if you put 也 on the end of a statement it increases the air of certainty, the second one says if you put it on the end of a question it increases the air of doubt, it you put it on the end of an expression of regret, it increases the tone of regret, etc. It looks complicated when it is split into so many different meanings but a lot of them boil down to pretty much the same thing. It is maybe a bit of an oversimplification to equate it with 啊, but it is basically the same, an intensifier that increases the 语气 of whatever it is put with that is generally not independently meaningful.

When it comes to 语气 it is best not to rely on a dictionary too much, seeing how it is used in context is more helpful. That was a lot of the point of my first post, to read 三国演义 it is not necessary to exhaustively study the detail of everything that looks different to modern Chinese in advance, it is generally not that different that you can't just jump in and work it out as you go along. I gather it may be different for "real" Classical Chinese, but I've never attempted that.

Completely agree that 三国演义 won't be everyone's cup of tea. I could see myself being much less interested in it now if I had been made to study the history in school like most Chinese people. And it is quite a "blokey" book, that seems to put a lot of women off.

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I have it in a 对照 version, started on it, then thought I was reading too fast as it's such a dense book with big important plot points and character development happening in only a few paragraphs. Perhaps I should read the Chinese side to slow myself down a bit and digest it better. Thanks for the write-up, perhaps it is managable then.

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Congrats on finishing it, that's a great accomplishment! I enjoyed it too while I was 'consistently' reading it (I should check how far I actually got into it hmmm..), but then I set it down for too long and failed to pick it up again.
:wall

The difficulty I found in reading it, is I personally feel/recommend one must read one whole chapter straight through, otherwise, it's quite difficult to remember all of the thousand or so
and the many plots, once you let the book collect some dust...oops

However, I feel that reading this definitely helps with character recognition and knowing different titles of officials and such, weapons, forms of torture, etc. (edit: & execution)
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And it is quite a "blokey" book, that seems to put a lot of women off.

It doesn't put me off at all! Sometimes I even re-tell the funny and/or suspenseful parts to my kids.

weapons, forms of torture,

That is exactly what attracts me to reading Three Kingdoms.

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Dude, you rock. That's the second classic you're finished while I'm still struggling with my first.

Let me get one thing straight. If I understand correctly, you finished this in three months?!??!??

Luckily, I already had picked up from somewhere that classical Chinese uses 吾 for 我 and 汝 for你. 三国演义 however uses all four characters.

One thing I noticed in 水浒传 is that these things often depends on who says them. Different characters (coming from different parts of the country) will often have a specific (and consistent) way of speaking. This includes vocabulary and erhua too. This probably also plays a role in 三国.

I had also heard that 也 at the end of sentences was one of the key characteristics of classical Chinese, unfortunately, I hadn't heard what this actually meant.

I've always taken it to be a strong copula. So in classical passages, I translate it as "is".

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The difficulty I found in reading it, is I personally feel/recommend one must read one whole chapter straight through, otherwise, it's quite difficult to remember all of the thousand or so characters and the many plots, once you let the book collect some dust...oops

One thing that has really been helpful with 水浒传 was taking notes about characters and what they did in my own words.

Without my notes, I'd have been lost a quarter of the way through.

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