Traditional Chinese Medicine at Birth

[chip256]

Hi!

 

I am trying to learn more about traditional Chinese birth and the medicine, foods, practices, do and don'ts, etc... for birth.  I don't want to turn this into a debate over the scientific aspects (although I am open to comments) but I would appreciate a reason as to why said practice is used.

 

I am aware of the sitting month where the mother is not allowed cold foods, no bathing, especially no hair washing, no air conditioning.  I have also heard that the mother needs to drink no water at all but should drink a rice wine, but that is the extent of my knowledge.  I don't know anything about how the child should be treated at all.

 

Does anyone have some good resources for this information or can provide personal knowledge?  All of my google searches turn up what I already stated above but the wine thing was a shocker.

 

Thanks!

[Tianjin42]

Hi Chip256,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

Its not an area I am especially knowledgeable in but I was very interested in the month of convalescence that you mentioned (commonly referred to as  坐月子). 

I understand that you don't want this to simply be a debate on scientific aspects but full disclosure - I was interested in this 坐月子 from this perspective. A number of Chinese colleagues went through this after giving birth and I was interested in the dynamic between young people and older traditional views (at the same time I was interested in the expensive anti-radiation vests that many pregnant women wear - fascinating). 

 

I found the practice to be misguided in the extreme. Whilst convalescence for a new mother is no bad thing, what I witnessed (admittedly as a non-specialist) was a an archaic practice that was harmful to the recipient. Older women were present to ensure that there were no drafts or "wind" (citing loose joints of new mothers) but at the same time they would not allow the mother anything more than a rudimentary wash. This seemed deeply unhygienic to me, and along with the fact that the mother was not meant to even leave the room I suspect there are both physical and mental sacrifices in the name of this particular tradition. 

 

In the case of some of my friends and colleagues, there was a compromise as they themselves weren't totally convinced about this practice but would go along for the sake of the older generation. But still there were cases where the mother was in a fairly filthy condition and I found it to be archaic and anti-women. 

[Flickserve]

My unsubstantiated theory is that this one month practice came about because maternal and infant mortality would have been quite high in olden days. Lack of fresh running water and infectious disease are dangerous things. Lack of knowledge on transmission of disease would also contribute. There were nasty things like bubonic plague hanging around.

There's lack of justification for it now, but that's culture for you.

[Flickserve]

Drinking papaya soup is good.

Drinking rice wine doesn't seem to be common in HK but it is used for cooking.

[Lu]

A theory I read (perhaps here) on 坐月子 was that one of the reasons for it was to have the husband leave the wife alone for a while so she could recover. With dirty hair, long fingernails and little washing, she wouldn't be very attractive, and that would have helped.

[realmayo]

I don't see how a month with only a rudimentary wash each day could be dangerous to health. I say this not from personal lifestyle choices, you understand.

[Tianjin42]

@realmayo

I understand, but feel it isn't a normal month. When a women has just given birth, is possibly covered in blood, as well being very drained and susceptible to infection, having to remain in fairly filthy conditions did seem an unnecessary risk.

[realmayo]

Fair enough, I have to admit I assumed women got an an initial cleaning-off of the crap, blood, and other fluids. And of course hand washing is important after defecation. But if you do wash your hands after, and if you're not covered in blood and afterbirth, I don't think not showering for a month ought to cause health problems? Anyone want to give it a try?

[roddy]

I think in the past, it probably made a lot more sense. If I'd given birth in 18th century China I'd probably have been quite happy to stay very very still for a while. 

 

Where'd you hear the rice wine thing? That sounds so outlandish I'm inclined to think it's a misunderstanding somewhere along the line, or one family's bizarre tradition rather than a common thing. 

[Tianjin42]

Fair enough. But I was unimpressed that it still lingers on today. Colleagues who wanted to shower after 15 days, or go for a walk to stretch legs after a few weeks in a room were not allowed. It was quite a trial for some of them.

[Flickserve]

Fair enough, I have to admit I assumed women got an an initial cleaning-off of the crap, blood, and other fluids. And of course hand washing is important after defecation. But if you do wash your hands after, and if you're not covered in blood and afterbirth, I don't think not showering for a month ought to cause health problems? Anyone want to give it a try?

they clean themselves with a wet cloth. Not washing hair for a month is a bit tricky though. I think most would have to wash their hair quite secretively. This one month tradition is also practiced in Singapore and Malaysia.

[chip256]

 

Its not an area I am especially knowledgeable in but I was very interested in the month of convalescence that you mentioned (commonly referred to as  坐月子). 

I understand that you don't want this to simply be a debate on scientific aspects but full disclosure - I was interested in this 坐月子 from this perspective. A number of Chinese colleagues went through this after giving birth and I was interested in the dynamic between young people and older traditional views (at the same time I was interested in the expensive anti-radiation vests that many pregnant women wear - fascinating). 

What I really want to accomplish here is a list of items to expect so I can discuss them with my doctor.  Then my doctor can help me decide of the merits of each.  I find the discussing this topic is nearly taboo like discussing politics or religion.

 

My mother-in-law is going to force many of these traditional items and she won't discuss them in advance so I need to be prepared.

 

 

 

I don't see how a month with only a rudimentary wash each day could be dangerous to health. I say this not from personal lifestyle choices, you understand.

I have already discussed with my doctor about being bed ridden for a few days as is some traditions to be confined in bed for a few days.  The doctor strongly advised against that because it may cause blood clots.

 

 

 

Where'd you hear the rice wine thing? That sounds so outlandish I'm inclined to think it's a misunderstanding somewhere along the line, or one family's bizarre tradition rather than a common thing. 

This one came from the mother-in-law as it ended up on the shopping list.

 

 

Thanks!

[gato]

Are you going to be the mother or father? If it's you who's going to be mother, then tell your husband to keep his mom in check. If she's wife's mom, you may need it to be more creative and conduct more passive resistance.

[oceancalligraphy]

The rice wine isn't for drinking directly, it's for making soups. I'm not an expert in any of this, but from the cultural perspective it comes from the way of thinking that things are cool and warm, especially food.

 

For example, we just passed winter solstice and one of the traditional foods to eat is sesame oil and ginger chicken. It's all cooked in a soup. The idea is that these are things that will warm the body or treat the body from chills of the outside temperature. It doesn't even have to be due to the temperature, but can be eaten whenever one feels tired or just not up to snuff. 

 

Given what one's body goes through during childbirth, the same analogy applies: mom needs to be taken care of and be warmed. That's why there's a lot of soup cooked with rice wine. Not bathing or washing hair, not drinking cold water, and no air conditioning goes along with this thinking, since doing so will chill the body.

 

The time is also about taking care of baby. Mothers are encouraged to eat food that will help with lactation. It is also bonding time with baby. No housework, not allowed to leave the house, and someone to help with baby might be nice for the first few weeks after childbirth.

 

Now in the old times this would be standard to sit a whole month, but in modern times not so much. In Asia, there are swanky post-childbirth hotels that new moms can go to, with trained nurses around 24 hours and prepared meals. Also, some people just choose to do what feels right for them: longer or shorter.

 

Two things that might be of interest are this article from Audrey magazine, which is from the perspective of a Taiwanese American, and this blog series from Taiwanxifu 臺灣媳婦, who is a Western woman living in Taiwan.

[Flickserve]

In China, there are post child birth hotels. Not in HK,Malaysia nor Singapore as far as I know.

[oceancalligraphy]

 

In China, there are post child birth hotels. Not in HK,Malaysia nor Singapore as far as I know. 

 

 

I've heard that in Hong Kong building prices probably make it unfeasible or not profitable. Instead, people like to hire a confinement nanny to live with them. This article from a Western woman in Hong Kong describes that experience.

[Flickserve]

I've heard that in Hong Kong building prices probably make it unfeasible or not profitable. Instead, people like to hire a confinement nanny to live with them. This article from a Western woman in Hong Kong describes that experience.

I would have to say that in HK, having a live in confinement nanny is not the norm as most people do not have the space to accommodate an extra person. The majority are live out confinement nannies who arrive around 9-10am after doing the shopping and leave the home at 6pm or so just like a normal job. You are looking at over USD2k per month for this service.

There was a big article in China Daily discussing confinment hotels and nannies. Expected big boom in business with 1 Jan commencement of two child policy.

I have to say, it wouldn't surprise me if there was tremendous regional variation in the recommendation of food to eat and drink. Probably a Chinese language based forum will give better feedback.