二 and 兩

[Glenn]

I've learned that 兩 is used with measure words (including 百, 千, 萬, etc.), and that 二 is used for counting without measure words, for reciting numbers in a list (e.g. 二零零二年), and in any number including 2 from 12-92. I'm guessing that this is true for any time a number 12-92 with 2 in it occurs in a larger number as well. I was wondering if these were right:

七百十二本書

兩千百零兩個人

十二万兩千

I think those are enough to cover all of my questions on the usage of the two "two"s. I always feel uneasy about which one to use.

[eddiewouldgo]

七百十二本書 七百一十二本書

兩千百零兩個人 兩千零兩個人

[Glenn]

七百十二本書 七百一十二本書

So even though 十二 is 12, when I want to say x hundred 12 I have to use 一十二?

兩千百零兩個人 兩千零兩個人

I meant 2,102 people, not 2,002 people. I guess that means it should have been 兩千一百零兩個人. Does this mean that if there is only one of either the hundreds or the tens unit and it is the largest unit, 一 isn't used, but if it's not the largest unit then 一 is necessary?

For example: 十四條河 and 百七十六本書, but 五百一十條河 and 一千一百七十六本書

Do all of the other units (千, 萬, 億, etc.) always take 一 when there is only one of them? E.g. 100,000,000 -> 一億?

[chenpv]

Glenn, thats a very good question.

first, '二' is used in formal expression of numbers and '两' is used in oral expression of numbers.

second, 万，千，百，十 can not be used without numbers before them. if its a zero, you should use 零.

third, '亿' ‘万’‘个' (个 is usually omitted)are the three basic units in chinese. their usage are much alike 'billion, million' in english.

note the examples:

1 一

10 一十 this is only exception: we can say 十

12 十二

100 一百

102 一百零二 （note：the unit 十 is omitted and replaced by 零）

120 一百二十

200 二百，两百 （note：in oral chinese, 两 can only be used before units superior to

百）

1000 一千

1002 一千零二

1022 一千零二十二

1202 一千二（两）百零二

10000 一万

10002 一万零二

10202 一万零二（两）百零二

12020 一万二（两）千零二十

20000 二（两）万

120000 十二万

200000 二十万 （we are not saying 两十万，because 十 is not superior to 百）

1020000 一百零二万 （note：we are not saying 一百万零两万，because 万 is a basic unit, one is enough）

120000000 一亿二（两）千万。

[geek_frappa]

Do all of the other units (千, 萬, 億, etc.) always take 一 when there is only one of them? E.g. 100,000,000 -> 一億?

this is a good question. the answer is..... it depends.

try playing around with these. it's only correct 97% of the time, though.

100,000,000

http://www.pzlabs.com/chinese/u.php?search=100%2C000%2C000

20303023

http://www.pzlabs.com/chinese/u.php?search=20303023

[shibo77]

二er4 means two, as the number only;

两liang3 (liang2 if used to count before a third tone character) means two, as the counter only;

When I say: "2222(Two-thousand two-hundred and twenty-two) is a composite number."

The 2 is solely a number, so I use 二er4: "二百二十二是合数。(Er4 bai3 er4 shi2 er4 shi4 he2 shu4.)"

When I say: "This island nation has a population of 2222(two-thousand two-hundred and twenty-two)."

The 2 is used to count the number of people on the island, so I use 两liang3: "这个岛国拥有人口两千两百二十二。(Zhei4 ge5 dao3 guo2 yong1 you3 ren2 kou3 liang3 qian1 liang2 bai3 er4 shi2 er4.)"

-Shìbó

[roddy]

Am I right in saying that when talking about rice (or something measured by weight) and you want to buy two liangs of it, you would say 二两 rather than 两两? That's what we used to say in the school canteen way back when i first came to China, anyway. I used to feel all proud because I could order my rice, but then had to get the actual 菜 by dumb pointing

And what about measure words that sound a bit like 两 - 辆 is the only one I can think of though, and that's a different tone.

Roddy

[fenlan]

I thought two vehicles was liang3liang4che1

[Quest]

两 and 十 never go together, left or right.

两 can be used in other digits where 十 is not adjacent.

零 is inserted where there's a skipped digit, consecutive 零s count as one 零.

other rules:

see shibo's post

七百十二本書

兩千百零兩個人

一 can only be omitted when it is in the 十s digit AND when it is the first number at the left end.

七百一十二本書

兩千一百零二個人

十六万零一百一十六只小鸡

[chenpv]

And what about measure words that sound a bit like 两 - 辆 is the only one I can think of though, and that's a different tone.

只 - 支 - 枝 （一只鸡 - 一支试管 - 一枝花）

副 - 幅 （一副手套 - 一幅画）

片 - 爿 （They look alike but have different sounds. 一片树叶 - 一爿小店）

批 - 匹 （一批货物 - 一匹马）

间 - 件 （一间房屋 - 一件衣服）

颗 - 棵 - 克 - 刻 （一颗宝石 - 一颗树 - 一克黄金 - 一刻钟）

张 - 丈 （一张桌子 - 一丈高）

叶 - 页 （一叶扁舟 - 一页书）

炷 - 株 （一炷香 - 一株草）

[hakkaboy]

yes, but chenpv you did not clear up the doubt about how to say "2 vehicles". As far as I know, it is: 两辆车, but someone implied that liang3 and liang4 cannot go together, but I never heard of 二辆车. Can you clear up this mystery?

[Quest]

yes, but chenpv you did not clear up the doubt about how to say "2 vehicles". As far as I know, it is: 两辆车, but someone implied that liang3 and liang4 cannot go together, but I never heard of 二辆车. Can you clear up this mystery?

两辆车(liang3 liang4 che1) is fine.

[chenpv]

Hakkaboy, Quest is right. 两辆车(liang3 liang4 che1) is fine to me, too.