Christa Posted June 5, 2019 at 09:56 AM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 09:56 AM Hi everyone, I've sometimes found that the English loan words in Chinese that I sometimes use are not recongised everywhere that I use them. In particular regarding food. For instance, for "hamburger" I personally would always say "汉堡". However, it seems that that is only used in Taiwan and not in Mainland China. It seems maybe that the word for "pizza" can vary as well. Anyway, I've made a short list of terms below that I think are perhaps the standard terms used on the Mainland. What do you think of them? Do these seem like the words most commonly used for these western food names based on loan words? Hamburger 汉堡包 Pizza 披萨 Sandwich 三明治 Bagel 贝果 Yogurt 优格 Chocolate 巧克力 Brownie 布朗尼 Doughnut 多拿滋 Croissant 可颂 Cheese 起司 Coke / Pepsi / Cola 可乐 McDonald's 麦当劳 KFC 肯德基 So, do you use these words yourself or do are there other terms for these western imports that you would consider more standard? Be interested to hear what people think! Christa 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abcdefg Posted June 5, 2019 at 10:30 AM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 10:30 AM 54 minutes ago, Christa said: For instance, for "hamburger" I personally would always say "汉堡". However, it seems that that is only used in Taiwan and not in Mainland China. 汉堡 is used here on the mainland. The Burger King chain is 汉堡王。In addition to meaning a "hamburger sandwich" made with ground beef, 汉堡 is used as a generic term, such that you see things like 鸡腿堡 (chicken leg sandwich.) Quote Yogurt 优格 Yogurt is usually 酸奶。Cheese is usually 奶酪。 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChTTay Posted June 5, 2019 at 11:26 AM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 11:26 AM (edited) Second that! Not sure why you think 汉堡 isn't on the mainland. Is there another word? 甜甜圈 is donut. If I type it into my phone a little donut picture pops up. Never seen cheese referred to as 起司. It’s usually 奶酪 or 芝士 Edited June 5, 2019 at 12:48 PM by ChTTay 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted June 5, 2019 at 12:21 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 12:21 PM Croissant also often 牛角面包 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomsima Posted June 5, 2019 at 12:56 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 12:56 PM 34 minutes ago, Jim said: Croissant also often 牛角面包 interesting haha, ive only ever heard 羊角麵包 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomsima Posted June 5, 2019 at 12:59 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 12:59 PM 3 hours ago, Christa said: Cheese 起司 芝士 is a more common phonetic translation on the mainland, but you'll more likely hear 奶酪 from my experience also for doughnut I remember ive heard 甜甜圈 before, but don't know if thats just cute kiddy speak or normal usage... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xinoxanu Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:16 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:16 PM The use of 奶酪 and 芝士 is indeed a weird one in Mainland China. Burger King, McDonald's and Pizza Hut usually use 芝士 in their product descriptions, but 奶酪 tends to be used instead when face to face with the staff. And then you get Carrefour, a French company, that carries plenty of different cheese over here and can't make up its mind about what is what, even when it's the same and both products are place next to each other. Chinese is a weird language for sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publius Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:36 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:36 PM I believe 芝士 is Cantonese influence. And Chinese is a language family, not a language. 堡 or 汉堡 is like the English suffix 'burger'. It gets attached to many things that are technically sandwiches. For example, I follow the McDonald's staff's suit and call McSpicy Chicken Fillet Burger 辣腿堡 or 腿儿堡. I've never heard or seen 优格 used in my life. 酸奶 is a perfectly meaningful name that existed before there was Coca Cola or McDonald in mainland China. I find most giggle inducing is the name 法棍. Yeah, that's baguette for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:48 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:48 PM I like chickpeas but always seems a toss-up whether they're sold as 鹰嘴豆 or 鸡嘴豆 and I have a feeling I've seen something else too like 埃及豆 but not. ETA Though a quick search says maybe it was: And it seems in Taiwan they can be 雪莲子 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michaelyus Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:55 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 01:55 PM 芝士 is definitely standard in Cantonese as well as mainland Mandarin. 起司 is most common in Taiwan Mandarin, as well as usual in Malaysia and Singapore. I wonder how long it'll take for 酸奶 to be distinguished from 芝士/起司 - I see the beginnings of a prestige-based split. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publius Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:06 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:06 PM Agree. Like 樱桃/车厘子, 葡萄/提子, 李子/布朗. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publius Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:16 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:16 PM So how is "Who Moved My Cheese" translated in Taiwan? Not 誰動了我的奶酪? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murrayjames Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:56 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:56 PM Another interesting transliterated food name is 曲奇 (qūqí) for cookie, as found in 冰淇淋曲奇. I have also seen the word 曲奇饼 (qūqíbǐng), which I am tempted to translate as “cookie cookie.” 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ema Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:58 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 02:58 PM Hi Christa, Studying Chinese here in Italy, Ive been taught 比萨饼 for pizza! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xinoxanu Posted June 5, 2019 at 03:05 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 03:05 PM 1 hour ago, Publius said: And Chinese is a language family, not a language. A rather condescending comment, if I may say so, and totally unnecessary in a post about food. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christa Posted June 5, 2019 at 03:46 PM Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 03:46 PM So "汉堡" and "披萨" are both fine to use in the Mainland? That's a relief... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xinoxanu Posted June 5, 2019 at 04:23 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 04:23 PM 29 minutes ago, Christa said: So "汉堡" and "披萨" are both fine to use in the Mainland? That's a relief... Well, yes... but if you ask for those while in here you'll find that instead of a quarter pound with cheese you'll receive a fried chicken breast with a single leaf of lettuce on a thousand island "buttered" bun. And if you ask for pizza you'll receive a fruit salad on a piece of cardboard and complimentary milk tea refill. I have a Napolitano friend that got over the infamous pineapple pizza issue 24h after having landed here. Ah, If world issues were fixed as simply as a Chinese interpretation on a western dish, we could spend more time studying this beautiful family of languages instead of watching visceral news day after day... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
陳德聰 Posted June 5, 2019 at 04:25 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 04:25 PM 1 hour ago, xinoxanu said: A rather condescending comment, if I may say so, and totally unnecessary in a post about food. Well then I'll bring it to full condescension with another accurate statement about language, and tell you that there is little, if not nothing about Chinese that is particularly more weird than any other language from a linguistics standpoint, and your comment was unnecessary first, in a post about food. As a tyrannical mod, I'll take the last word on that in this thread about food, please and thanks. Anyways, if we're talking about pizza, I have seen 披薩 and 批薩 and 比薩餅. Do non-Cantonese speakers say 薄餅? 曲奇 sounds like "kuk-kei" in Cantonese so that is a likely origin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xinoxanu Posted June 5, 2019 at 04:40 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 04:40 PM 2 minutes ago, 陳德聰 said: As a tyrannical mod, I'll take the last word on that in this thread about food, please and thanks. Lol. I'll take the ban-hammer if I must as long as the following doesn't get deleted, but come on, I think the most unnecessary comment in this post was yours, with a moderation threat after a single complain. You win. I speak 5 languages and yes, all of them are weird, and remarking on that shouldn't be an issue, especially considering that the distinction I was talking about is indeed a weird one compared to the word "cheese", which encompasses a wide selection of curated and fresh milk products. So yeah, Chinese is weird in this case and as learners of the language it's a pretty common statement that we all have said and heard. In any case, the issue here was with Plubius correcting me on the use of the word "Chinese", which is perfectly fine in English to refer to Mandarin/Cantonese without counting the other dozens of sinitic languages. What can we do, we westerners are limited when it comes to understanding foreign cultures... Also it's the second time today I have this same argument with a Chinese person so I jumped at it. My bad, more self-control would be great but gotta spend the time studying Chinese to avoid these mistakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shelley Posted June 5, 2019 at 05:02 PM Report Share Posted June 5, 2019 at 05:02 PM I don't think @Publius was in anyway trying to be condescending. I think he was just trying to make the point that one should expect lots of variation in translations as there is lot of variation in the language. I don't think its any different to food names round the world, I know foods that are called one thing in the south of the UK but up north in Scotland are called something completely different. Its all still English just different uses and dialects. If it was me and I wanted to order a cheeseburger I would ask a friend or teacher what are cheeseburgers called round here. You just have to find out what is used where you are and go with it. You could go 10 miles down the road and find they call it something different. That is language, that is life. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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