Listening to Audiobooks

[phills]

I settled on a routine for leveling up my listening.  As you may know, I've been focusing on reading the past 6 months, and now I have that mostly under control, I'm focusing on listening.  Similar to reading, I think volume is key. 

 

My plan is to listen to audiobooks of stuff I read last year.  My goal is to do it: 1) at full speed, 2) without pausing, 3) without looking at text, and 4) (stretch) while doing other brainless stuff like chores.  So far I've tried it for 2 weeks, about 15 hours, and wanted to track / share my progress.

 

1. Baseline: Last I worked on my listening, I had focused on watching Chinese dramas.  I had watched 3 series (about 40-ish episodes each), so had about 100 hrs of focused listening to native content.  However, I was listening with subtitles the whole time, plus pausing a lot, and I ended up training my reading as much as my listening.

 

The net result was my listening ability was still very sporadic.  I could understand only short sentences at full speed.  I had tried listening to some Upper Intermediate audio on duchinese and I could only understand it if I also read subtitles at the same time.  If it wasn't concurrent reading, I needed to get to half speed, sometimes 3/4 speed, with pauses, to understand ~70% of it -- if I listened after I read the text. 

 

I got lost easily facing a wall of foreign sounds.  Once lost, I wouldn't be able to refind the thread and had to stop.

 

2. When I started: Because I read all of audiobook content already last year, I had hopes I'd be able to jump right ahead to listening at full speed, without the text.  Nope.  Got lost again. 

 

Also, my stamina was bad, I had to quit after 10 mins or so.  And when I restarted, I'd quit and pause often, limiting my sessions to under half hour total.

 

So as a compromise, I kept listening at full speed and not pause, but would keep the text open in another window.  Every 15 seconds or so, I'd glance at the text just to keep my "context" fresh.  Even when I didn't exactly read when I glanced, it helped to keep myself oriented. 

 

3. Now 15 hours in: My stamina is built up.  My sessions have gone from 20 mins to ~1.5 hrs. 

 

For the last couple of days, I finally was able to not open up the text in another window, and still keep track of the content. When I get lost, I can rezone back in after 30 seconds or so, and figure out where I am again.  I didn't have to stop or pause.

 

My comprehension is still not that great.  I'd estimate only 60-70% of the words are understood, but it's enough to get the gist of the story.  However, even when I don't exactly understand the words, I understand what the purpose of the unknown words were -- meaning they're describing an object, it's an action scene with A doing stuff to B, someone is waxing eloquently about the human spirit etc.  That's often enough to maintain the thread.

 

The best part though is the ability to re-orient myself if I get lost.  This doesn't seem to be content specific -- it helps even with new stuff, random audio that I haven't heard before.  If I can't figure it out right away, just wait a little bit, and I can slowly re-figure out what's going on.

 

With that, and the increased stamina, I find listening actually takes less energy than reading.  Even though my listening is still way behind my reading, I find I can just keep listening to more and more text.  It doesn't feel like it's as much "work" as each time I exceeded my reading limits. 

 

4. Listening v. Reading speed:  I've gone through at least one complete book in audio.  Comparing the time spent listening to that book vs the number of characters in the book, I find the audio goes at 273 cpm.  That's still faster than my leveled-up reading speed, which is humbling.

 

On the other hand, it suggests that listening might eventually help me read faster, so I'll have to see if that's true.  I'm a big believer in you having to train your brain to process the Chinese words at the proper speed, whether it's for reading, listening or talking.  So listening is still helping train me to process Chinese words at higher speed than before (and I can even go 125% or 150% speed later on).

 

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Anyways wanted to see if others have tried similar things or what they thought.  Every third day or so, I'm putting in a conventional session of reading so I can maintain it.

[Jan Finster]

1.5 hours of active listening is impressive stamina.

 

On 1/14/2022 at 7:24 AM, phills said:

it suggests that listening might eventually help me read faster,

From my experience this is true. Especially if you follow the text while you listen. Then, your brain gets to passively "read" while you listen and this will further ingrain the characters in your brain. I guess listening without text and then listening with text would be ideal, but then you would need monster self-discipline not to get bored. 

 

On 1/14/2022 at 7:24 AM, phills said:

My comprehension is still not that great.  I'd estimate only 60-70% of the words are understood, but it's enough to get the gist of the story. 

I guess 60-70% is only enough to follow the story, because you have read the text before. Whenever I try to listen to something new and I only understand 70% of the stuff, yes, I  can tell it is about (e.g.) the Beijing Olympics and skiing, but not much more.

 

 

Please keep posting your progress. Very interesting!

 

 Would you mind sharing the titles of the audiobooks and where you get them from (if it is "unofficial" sources, freel free to pm me ?

[phills]

On 1/14/2022 at 3:43 PM, Jan Finster said:

Would you mind sharing the titles of the audiobooks and where you get them from (if it is "unofficial" sources, freel free to pm me ?

 

A lot of it is on ximalaya.com.  Especially anything translated from English.  E.g.  The Magician's Nephew 魔法师的外甥:

 

https://www.ximalaya.com/album/18473173

 

Stuff that's only in Chinese is harder but you can google it too ([chinese book title] 听书).  E.g. 圈子圈套

 

https://3w.tiantingfm.com/guanchangshangzhan/quanziquantao1zhanjupian/0-1.html

 

The thing is audio links decay faster, so 6 months later, both of these may be gone.  Some of the original links I found when I was assessing the viability of this plan are gone, but I found replacements.

 

On 1/14/2022 at 3:43 PM, Jan Finster said:

I guess 60-70% is only enough to follow the story, because you have read the text before. Whenever I try to listen to something new and I only understand 70% of the stuff, yes, I  can tell it is about (e.g.) the Beijing Olympics and skiing, but not much more.

 

Yes.  That's a big reason I picked audio books.  It's part of my training wheels.  Also, it's been months up to a year since I read it, so it's not like I remember everything.  Parts of it still suprise me -- oh I forgot that bit.

 

The plan is I'm going to level up my percentage and than try new books.  E.g. one wrinkle I'm going to experiment with is to listen to a sequel of a book without having read it.  Since I'm still listening faster than reading, that'll save time.

 

On 1/14/2022 at 3:43 PM, Jan Finster said:

1.5 hours of active listening is impressive stamina.

 

Stamina is highly related to comprehension, in my experience.  If you get lost, your brain will revolt.  But if you keep your thread, you can keep going even if you don't understand everything.

 

Plus I'm listening to stuff I read that I liked, so I'm entertained.  Listening to children books reminds me of kids listening to bed time stories, or kids listening to stories around a fire, so I imagine it's very natural form of language acquisition.

[phills]

Also long form is sometimes easier to process than shorter content.  I find that in reading too.  It takes some time to "warm up".  You get used to the style, the setting; you learn all the character names and place names, and the types of interactions.  Even reading novels, it takes me up to 50k chars to warm up. 

 

I find that in listening too, as you keep listening to the same book, it gets easier.  Later on, even if you don't understand everything in a sentence, you can still figure out what's going on.  You can't do that in the beginning.  If you don't understand something in a sentence at the beginning of a story, that sentence is a lost cause.

 

When you're reading / listening to short pieces, you're constantly trying to orient yourself.  By the time you achieved it, it's over; and you don't get to enjoy the payoff.  Learners focus on shorter pieces because they don't have the stamina; but once you have it, longer stuff is easier and more enjoyable.  You can get into that "flow state" which is the most natural.

[Jan Finster]

Thanks.

 

I tried to find the chess master since you posted about it. Unfortunately, only the first couple of chapters are free on Ximalaya (https://www.ximalaya.com/youshengshu/31456239/) and I have not found a way to pay on Ximalaya with a western credit card and some of the .txt versions I found seem incomplete (99 pages).

 

 

[phills]

ximalaya is semi-monetized, so a lot of the Chinese stories are pay walled.  The selection of translated English/foreign language stories seems better.

 

From quick googling, I didn't find a free audio link for 棋王.

 

棋王 is pretty short though -- it's only 30k chars, so 99 pages might not be incomplete.  I'll PM you the version that I read (with 3 stories), if you're interested.

[alantin]

@phillswhere do you find the audiobooks?

 

haha! Maybe I should read a litte furher before asking… I found 三体 on ximalaya myself but there seems to be some kinds of geo restrictions there so I can’t listen to it reliably.

[MoonIvy]

Your comment on getting use to novels after 50k characters is pretty interesting, and also very true. Whenever I start a new audiobook (previously have not read the book), I always have to really focus in the first few chapters, and once I'm use to all the characters, names etc I'm able to listen while being busy. 

I always tend to recommend people to listen to podcast because it's shorter and it's something you can pick up at anytime. Next time I'm in a conversation about this, I'll definitely mention that one can get use to an audiobook and it can become easier overtime.

I see you're using ximalaya which I use to use, but recently it's geo locking me out  I've since switch to use 微信读书 and 微信听书 (both have transcripts, including the podcast in 微信听书). Their freeium model is pretty good!

[phills]

On 1/15/2022 at 6:22 AM, MoonIvy said:

I see you're using ximalaya which I use to use, but recently it's geo locking me out  I've since switch to use 微信读书 and 微信听书 (both have transcripts, including the podcast in 微信听书). Their freeium model is pretty good!

 

微信读书 has a pretty good selection, but you can't download the book into .txt files.  I've got a bunch of scripts that I've made to capture vocab, time myself, character count, log my results and I need the .txt files to do that.

 

微信听书 seems to be mobile based only, and again as an old-fogey I prefer computer based solutions.  Plus I'm building up some scripts to log my audio progress too.  But I like the free 90 mins a day, so I might try it out later, once I get bored with my present routine.  So appreciate the tip.

 

I'm glad ximalaya hasn't locked me out yet using a US IP address.  Where are you accessing it from? I suspect some of the older links I found may be geolocked rather than just shut-down.  So even more reason to grind through all the ximalaya stuff first, if there's a chance they'll shut me out!

[alantin]

@phillsI was listening 三体 on Ximalaya last summer and got to about the middle of the second book when it started geo blocking me. I'm on iPhone and tried VPN too but it didn't help. I'm in Finland.

[MoonIvy]

@alantintry 微信听书 the exact same version of 三体 is on there. I had this exact same problem with other book, Ximalaya just started blocking me from using it, unforunately that book isn't available on 微信听书 so I had to go somewhere for it...rather annoying to be honest. Alternatively Himalaya (international version of Ximalaya) has the exact same version as well, but I don't know the VIP side works so I advise 微信听书 as you get free 90mins a day.

@phillsI'm from the UK. Some friends I know from around EU are also experiencing the same thing. The website still works but the app doesn't anymore. It won't let me play anything. I'm just waiting for more stuff to be loaded up 微信听书. Ximalaya is just pushing everyone to use their international app (Himalaya) 

[alantin]

@MoonIvy, thanks! I found it on 微信听书 and it was exactly the version I liked! Sadly I Himalaya wasn't available in app store in my region......

 

Any idea how to pay for more than 90 minutes?

Though 90 minutes a day is probably going to be enough for me.

[MoonIvy]

On 1/17/2022 at 10:21 PM, alantin said:

Any idea how to pay for more than 90 minutes?

They have a subscription service for unlimited listen, and it's pretty cheap. You need to pay through WePay (via WeChat) which I believe isn't available unless you have a Chinese bank account but I might be totally wrong though. I've not tried to paid for anything on either 微信读书 or 微信听书. You can give it a try and let me know what the results are. I know with some Chinese apps you can pay via Apple Pay or maybe 微信听书 also has Apple Pay intergration? Unforunately I have an Android phone so Google Pay is never available for me.

Every week as part of the weekly goals, you can get an additional 90mins per week. 

[MoonIvy]

@alantinA friend just told me, you can pay for 微信读书 or 微信听书 via Apple Pay on an iPhone.

[Jan Finster]

On 1/17/2022 at 5:03 PM, MoonIvy said:

Ximalaya is just pushing everyone to use their international app (Himalaya) 

 

Is Himalaya even providing Chinese content and Chinese audiobooks? On the website they say:  "Practical advice from world-class experts, packed into short audio lessons that will help you be happier, healthier, and more successful". It shows mostly western books by Warren Buffet, Steve Jobs, etc (https://www.himalaya.com/tag/1027) ?

[carlo]

there are lots of Chinese audiobooks on Audible and even on Youtube. Not sure about the copyright situation, but for 三体 see here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSzhwT7Rzzo

[MoonIvy]

On 1/18/2022 at 7:18 AM, Jan Finster said:

Is Himalaya even providing Chinese content and Chinese audiobooks?

Yes, just changed the location to China.

[alantin]

On 1/18/2022 at 1:36 AM, MoonIvy said:

@alantinA friend just told me, you can pay for 微信读书 or 微信听书 via Apple Pay on an iPhone.

 

Thanks! I'll have to try it sometime! I've been under the impression that Apple Pay doesn't work with WeChat.

 

 

On 1/18/2022 at 9:38 AM, carlo said:

Not sure about the copyright situation, but for 三体 see here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSzhwT7Rzzo

 

Yeah, I know this one... But I passionately dislike the narration. ? The one in in Ximalaya, and now also in 微信听书 is great to listen to!

[MoonIvy]

@alantinSame here to be honest! I myself don't have an iPhone so I didn't know about this but I've just been told by friends that Chinese apps do offer Apple Pay as a payment option. I've been using 微信读书 for a few months now. I've not had to pay for anything on 微信读书, there are just loads of way to get coins and VIP days. I just found that the same version of 三体 is also on 微信读书, so I'll recommend that instead of 微信听书 because I find  微信读书's freeium model is a lot better. Basically use both 微信读书 and 微信听书, if you can't find something on 微信读书, than use 微信听书.

[Jan Finster]

On 1/18/2022 at 10:30 AM, MoonIvy said:

Yes, just changed the location to China.

This is actually quite nice. I guess they still only have a fraction of the Ximalaya content on there, but once I get better, I might subscribe.

Should anyone see a promo code, please let us know.