gato Posted January 28, 2012 at 03:26 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 03:26 AM I'm just intrigued by this part of the story, not making an argument one way or another. Maybe someone can invite Mark Roswell to post here ;-) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wushijiao Posted January 28, 2012 at 04:29 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 04:29 AM OK...hehe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imron Posted January 28, 2012 at 04:52 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 04:52 AM but that CCTV went back to Dashan after his initial 1988 apperance and made him a star might not have been an accident. I'm sure it wasn't an accident - it was because they recognised they had a really popular performer and they wanted to milk that as far as they could. According to Wikipedia, his initial appearance (hosting a singing contest) wasn't what made him famous - it was a skit a couple of months later on the Spring Festival Gala that propelled him to stardom, also meaning that CCTV had already gone back to him previously - some 6 months before the events of '89. I just don't buy that there was some overarching conspiracy here to develop a Chinese speaking foreigner to help act in some way as a counter balance what happened in Tiananmen . That's a little too tin-foil hat for me. As for why Dashan and not other foreigners, well, the Spring Festival Gala has a way of making instant stars of certain people due to the audience connecting with their skit - just look at how 小沈阳's popularity skyrocketed after his first performance - how come other first-time performers at the Spring Festival Gala didn't become equally famous that year? Who knows, but I'm fairly sure it wasn't because 赵本山 had been tasked by Hu Jintao to groom someone to take the public's mind off whatever was troubling the nation at the time. I also recall reading an article some time back where Mark Rowswell mentioned he didn't even realise that the skit he was going to be doing for the Spring Festival Gala was going to be seen by basically all of China. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gato Posted January 28, 2012 at 05:50 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 05:50 AM Whether there was a political purpose, I still think it's fascinating that Roswell decided to stay in China after the 1989 massacre and became a TV star. I'd like to hear him to tell that part of the story someday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gato Posted January 28, 2012 at 06:38 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 06:38 AM That first skit on CCTV was for a New Year's eve show at the end of 1988 (not yet spring festival). Here is the video. His Chinese wasn't nearly as good back then. He still had a clear foreign accent. The pronunciation of the girl in the video was better than his. Both spoke very slowly. This was certainly work of a novice. I doubt that you can tell from this video that Mark Roswell would turn out to be the Chinese Superstar Dashan of later years. http://www.56.com/u5...TgzOTUxNjE.html 大山成名作小品《夜归》片段 http://phtv.ifeng.co...8205667_2.shtml 2011年08月05日 14:02 陈鲁豫：记得当年大山第一次登上中央电视台屏幕，那应该是一九八八年。 大山：一九八八年底。 陈鲁豫：一九八八年底，那第一次。 大山：对，因为我一九八八年的九月份来的嘛，大概十一月份就上电视。 陈鲁豫：那个小品的角色就叫大山。 大山：对。 陈鲁豫：后来我才知道，大山是真的有个人叫大山。 大山：有这个人，还叫许大山，对、对，这个名字，这个角色原来叫许秋佳，他们就觉得这个玉兰那么上口的名字，这许秋佳太绕嘴，然后再琢磨这么改一个什么，这个角色改一个名字吧，别叫许秋佳，结果正讨论这个问题的时候呢，在食堂吃饭，从厨房传出来的声音，嘿，大山你快点，这厨师叫许大山，他们一下子觉得这个名字好，许大山就改了。那么后来我上电视而且在这个节目里头，也是很突出这个名字嘛，很多观众因为那时候没有邮件，都是写信，很多观众写信，也不知道具体地址，就写北京大学留学生处，许大山同志收，全都转到了厨房。 陈鲁豫：我们来看看当年大山演的那个小品。 拜师姜昆 情结王文泉 解说：因为参加中央台的演出，大山迷上了相声这门语言艺术，同样在王文泉老师的撮合下，大山拜了著名相声演员姜昆为师，并在北大举行了非常正式的拜师仪式，大山没有辜负自己的老师们，一年之后就交出了满意的答卷。 姜昆：我也是一点一点看着大山成长起来的，那么我有这样一个学生，也非常高兴。全国我有很多的学生，按照中国的传统学生都很孝敬老师的，可是他呢我 经常孝敬他，我要给他制造各种各样的机会，让他来接触中国文化，要制造各种各样的机会让他能够走入我们，或者是融入我们中国这个生活圈子当中，我觉得只有 这样才能够让他更好地去发挥作用。 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imron Posted January 28, 2012 at 06:58 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 06:58 AM That's slightly conflicting with his Wikipedia article, which says: Rowswell first appeared on Chinese television to host an international singing competition in November 1988. The following month he was invited to perform a comedic skit on national television during the CCTV New Year's Gala, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gato Posted January 28, 2012 at 07:10 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 07:10 AM Yeah, the video of that skit performed at Beida was shown on a 元旦 CCTV show, not 春节 show. From the video, it looked like it was done in some gymnasium at Beida, with only a small audience in the bleachers. I can see how he didn't realized it would be viewed by the whole country. http://web.xwwb.com/wb2008/wb2008news.php?db=3&thisid=74218 天天新报 2010-05-21 09:22:16 大山第一次被中国观众认识是1989年央视元旦晚会上的小品《夜归》，而“大山”这个响亮中国名字也从这小品而来。大山自爆：“那时我刚到中国两个月，有机会出演小品，但一直没找到合适的中国名字。一次偶然的机会，我在北大的食堂里听见有人喊了声‘大山’，当时就灵感闪现，决定就用这个作为小品主人公的名字。”他笑说，其实“大山”确有其人，“是北大食堂的一位厨师。小品红了以后，许多观众写信去北大，写着‘大山收’，结果信都转到了食堂师傅那里，闹了不少笑话。”就从那时起，大山萌生了学习相声的念头，“在我看来，相声不仅能让我学习地道的语言，更包涵了博大的中国文化”。 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlo Posted January 28, 2012 at 10:12 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 10:12 AM Funny thought, though why then create a character that would become known and loved only by a (mass) domestic audience? Sure no foreign MNC in the 90s invested in China because of a Canadian guy on TV doing xiangsheng. No defiant intellectual fell on the road to Damascus after seeing Dashan doing skits on 大年夜. His own explanation makes more sense to me. He got lucky, and then gradually developed a persona that suited the needs of his newfound audience. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gato Posted January 28, 2012 at 10:41 AM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 10:41 AM If CCTV had a political agenda, it would be to show that "foreigners still love us, despite the killing of students." It obviously would entirely be for domestical consumption. It's just speculation based on the coincidence of the timeline. We don't have any proof one way or another. One thing for sure is that many things that the Chinese media does have a political purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meng Lelan Posted January 28, 2012 at 12:23 PM Report Share Posted January 28, 2012 at 12:23 PM pronunciation of the girl in the video was better than his. I remember that skit too and always wondered what became of that girl later on. She might have been from South America. foreigners still love us, despite the killing of students Really, and it's almost like having Barney the Big Purple Dinosaur sing tunes like the "老外 love China, China loves the 老外" instead of his famed "I love you, you love me" signature tune. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Patterson 包德 Posted February 2, 2012 at 11:54 AM Report Share Posted February 2, 2012 at 11:54 AM This is a great read. Honest and smart. I saw it on quora and am glad it's circulating outside quora now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangmu Posted March 23, 2012 at 08:43 AM Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 at 08:43 AM A great read thanks a lot. He comes across fairly well. I don't think foreginers really hate Dashan, although it is boring and irritating when he is mentioned too much. Times have rather moved on, and there are now many more foreigners with good chinese around. However, he is not completely honest with himself. Is there no harm at all to his persona and career? I have issue with at least one thing he says (probably more if I could be bothered to break the interview down further), which chimes with things I have held against his "persona", beautifully illustrated when he makes this defensive point: "I work within cultural norms. This spills over into the political realm, because, to be honest, Chinese cultural acceptance of foreign political criticism is almost nil. In short, I don’t have to worry about what government censors might say because Chinese audiences would never let me get that far anyway." Read this statement a couple of times. Its carefully crafted and that is reflective of something that he has probably convinced himself of. Maybe the statement is (possibly) true in the narrow circumstances where he has been allowed to be on television by a broadcaster controlled by the state. But otherwise it is absolutely not true at all that the Chinese cant deal with political criticism (its only the official state culture that cant). Does this statement attempt to reduce ordinary Chinese to mere cyphers? But if you don't know China, you might not realise this. But I do note that DS's career has been very lucrative for saying the right thing. Personally I would not do his job for all the riches in the world and even to further improve my Chinese ;-). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realmayo Posted March 23, 2012 at 10:06 AM Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 at 10:06 AM But otherwise it is absolutely not true at all that the Chinese cant deal with political criticism So you think that, if the government had no problem with it, it'd be possible for a foreigner to build a successful widely-watched stage act full of criticisms of China? I rather think Mark Roswell has a better idea about the kind of response he'd get than you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roddy Posted March 23, 2012 at 11:34 AM Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 at 11:34 AM What's he meant to do, go round the Chinese people one by one? it is boring and irritating when he is mentioned too much Only if you let it be . . . Taxi Driver: Your Chinese is good. Hey, do you know Dashan? You: A) Yeah. You know he's actually from Xinjiang? Was raised in Beijing. Total government conspiracy. B) Yeah. They do a great job of dubbing him. C) Sure. I hear he's getting extradited back to Canada pretty soon. Gee, if they'd never dug up his garden to lay those sewers . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skylee Posted March 23, 2012 at 12:08 PM Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 at 12:08 PM But otherwise it is absolutely not true at all that the Chinese cant deal with political criticism (its only the official state culture that cant). I doubt if it is absolutely not true. Criticism by the Chinese themselves, maybe they can deal with them. But criticism by a foreigner, hmmmm. But some of the posters here know so much about China. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meng Lelan Posted March 23, 2012 at 11:18 PM Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 at 11:18 PM But I do note that DS's career has been very lucrative for saying the right thing He seems like a paid puppet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realmayo Posted March 24, 2012 at 07:42 AM Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 at 07:42 AM I must have missed his lectures on the Three Represents and smashing various cults and how it's time for China to stand up against the West. Don't tell me, his tones were a bit off? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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