Coronavirus - those in China, and general discussion

[xinoxanu]

3 minutes ago, Demonic_Duck said:

Is it really any more invasive than nasal swabs? For all values of n > 1, I'd rather have a foreign object inserted n inches up my butt compared to my nose...

 

No, provided you bring your own lube. Airport regulations are a bit strict on that regard, container size and whatnot, so you might want to check that out before boarding.

 

 

[889]

A suggestion here that strict border controls will be in place until at least mid-2022 and more likely until the end of that year.

 

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy/article/3124300/covid-19-china-may-not-relax-border-controls-until-2022

[Flickserve]

I am inclined to agree. I am also assuming two years from now travelling will get easier, what with mutations and lack of attention to control measures in some countries, notably USA, Brazil, UK.

 

We have one vaccine this year but we will need another next year.

 

It's quite realistic to think in the future we will need a yearly covid vaccination similar to flu vaccinations.

[大块头]

On 3/4/2021 at 5:44 AM, roddy said:

compulsory anal swabs / stool samples for arrivals

 

I feel bad for the poor nurses who have to swab anuses all day.

[889]

I suspect we will be moving to a system of some sort in which you're going to have to demonstrate you've been vaccinated against Covid-19 in order to travel internationally and for other purposes.

 

So in the Mainland, and elsewhere, how are vaccination records being kept? In the U.S., for example, every state maintains a central registry of vaccinations of all types; in many but not all states you can simply download your record online.

 

If China has a similar registry, though, does it work for foreigners, given that so many systems in China only work with ID card numbers?

[mungouk]

13 minutes ago, 889 said:

If China has a similar registry, though, does it work for foreigners, given that so many systems in China only work with ID card numbers?

 

The "health codes" (QR codes) here work fine for foreigners, based on your passport number rather than your Chinese ID card number. Currently I use a mini-program in Alipay that gives a real-time green code to get into public places that are checking it, like shopping malls and the 地铁.

Lots of discussion world-wide just now about moving towards "vaccine passports"... it's not much of a stretch to imagine such a scheme being integrated with the QR code system, although currently this is fragmented and administered at a province level rather than nationally.
 

[889]

For months now we've all been reading about "vaccination passports" without a single hint as to how this could possibly work on a world-wide basis given all the different ways vaccination registries are maintained.

 

Point is, if you're to get vaccinated any time soon you want to make sure you're going to be able to prove it down the road.

 

[Jan Finster]

23 hours ago, Demonic_Duck said:

Is it really any more invasive than nasal swabs?

Come on! This is like saying an oral exam when entering prison is as bad as a rectal exam. Imaging you are a CEO, a diplomat, Joe Biden, etc and you have the choice between nasal swabs and anal swabs. Which one would you prefer? It has got nothing to do with being Joe Biden, but with human dignity (undressing, etc). Maybe some 20-ish prospective student does not mind, but I cannot imaging business travelers going for this "shit" (pun intended). Further, I really wonder what the whole point of testing before flights and/or having a proof of vaccine is, if you still have to get anal swabbed and spend 14 days in hotel quarantine....

 

BTW, does anyone know what happens if you test positive? Are you just quarantined for 14 days? 28 days? Hospitalised? Sent home / extradited ? 

[abcdefg]

12 hours ago, Jan Finster said:

BTW, does anyone know what happens if you test positive? Are you just quarantined for 14 days? 28 days? Hospitalised? Sent home / extradited ? 

 

60 days in a Xinjiang re-education camp. 

[Demonic_Duck]

6 hours ago, Jan Finster said:

Imaging you are ... Joe Biden

 

 

6 hours ago, Jan Finster said:

It has got nothing to do with being Joe Biden

 

 

OK, I'm imagining being Joe Biden in a situation where being Joe Biden is irrelevant. To be honest it's pretty much the same as not being Joe Biden.

[大块头]

9 hours ago, Jan Finster said:

BTW, does anyone know what happens if you test positive? Are you just quarantined for 14 days? 28 days? Hospitalised? Sent home / extradited ? 

 

The repercussions probably involve more anal swabbing at the very least.

[mungouk]

It's for Chinese citizens only right now, but they just launched a WeChat mini-program "防疫健康码国际版" (International Version of Epidemic Prevention Health Code) which displays the user's nucleic acid, IgG antibody test results and vaccination status.

 

Quote

On March 7, 2021, State Councilor Wang Yi announced the launch of the Chinese version of the "International Travel Health Certificate" at the Foreign Ministers' Press Conference of the "Two Sessions", and proposed a practical "China plan" for promoting the recovery of the world economy and facilitation of cross-border personnel exchanges. On March 8, the Chinese version of the "International Travel Health Certificate" WeChat Mini Program was officially launched, and Chinese citizens are welcome to use it.

 

More at China Launches NEW "International Travel Health Certificate" (Shekou Daily, 7 March 2021)

 

https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/XrEBodfBLjWEchWNhhVL_g

 

 

[mungouk]

1 hour ago, mungouk said:

Chinese citizens only right now

 

Interestingly though, the screen-grab of the mini-program shows "passport no." next to the name, rather than ID card number.

Which makes sense since it's for international travel.

 

 

[Jan Finster]

I may have missed it in this thread:

Does anyone know what percentage of the Chinese population is already vaccinated against COVID?

Is there a prioritization based on age/profession/etc. as in some other countries?

[mungouk]

China is vaccinating relatively slowly, around 3% of the population according to this report (scroll down to the interactive world map), compared to 28 doses per 100 people in  USA, 35 UK, 104 Israel. Figures don't match percentage of population exactly because the doses include second doses of vaccines that take that approach.

 

I've read reports that China is currently putting more effort into exporting vaccines because there are so few cases there. 

They are prioritising front-line health workers, elderly people and I think people working in cold supply-chains. Possibly teachers. Approach varies by province.

 

[xinoxanu]

3 minutes ago, mungouk said:

I've read reports that China is currently putting more effort into exporting vaccines because there are so few cases there. 

 

Yes, which is not a bad thing considering all the mad stockpiling some western countries are going for - which will inevitably lead to vaccines being thrown away or sent to Africa as part of relief packages that won't do shit. It wouldn't be the first time.

 

With actions like this China won't need a war to achieve world domination. 2050 can't come soon enough!

[Insectosaurus]

19 minutes ago, xinoxanu said:

Yes, which is not a bad thing considering all the mad stockpiling some western countries are going for - which will inevitably lead to vaccines being thrown away or sent to Africa as part of relief packages that won't do shit. It wouldn't be the first time.

 

With actions like this China won't need a war to achieve world domination. 2050 can't come soon enough!

 

Is there a joke I'm not getting here? I'm baffled by your post.

[xinoxanu]

22 minutes ago, timseb said:

Is there a joke I'm not getting here? I'm baffled by your post.

 

I commented on 4 different things in my post. Which one/s are you baffled by?

[Insectosaurus]

53 minutes ago, xinoxanu said:

I commented on 4 different things in my post. Which one/s are you baffled by?

 

The entire package. There is no stockpiling going on, the vaccines run out every week due to production being smaller than demand. Writing contracts for future boosters is not stockpiling. The fact that Russia and China see their opportunity to increase their soft power is quite expected.

 

Your comment that relief packages to Africa "won't do shit", was just a bit weird.

 

But mostly I was puzzled by your hinting at China would somehow be a desirable global leader. If that's not some joke I'm missing, future discussion would be futile.

[xinoxanu]

1 hour ago, timseb said:

There is no stockpiling going on, the vaccines run out every week due to production being smaller than demand.

 

Eh? Not only there's stockpiling in the physical sense already going on, but what you mean by "writing contracts for future boosters is not stockpiling" actually is when those numbers inevitably exceed all logic and will result in millions of unused, leftover vaccines at the end of this whole shitshow. This doesn't have to do with production eventually catching up and whatnot, but with the fact that rich countries ("poor countries" are too, but that's not relevant in this context) are only looking out for themselves in the first-ever real global pandemic. Same old, same old. What China is doing, instead, is using a 21st century calculator: they know how many vaccines they need right now and despite planning for the future, they are focusing on immediate gains, both in regards to global health and soft power. They win, we win. Isn't this is a better approach atm?

 

1 hour ago, timseb said:

Your comment that relief packages to Africa "won't do shit", was just a bit weird.

 

Which brings us to this. Spoiled vaccines, inadequate food and resources are sent to Africa on a constant basis to cover a given quota or inflate numbers. This kills people and perpetuates the current relief system, which is broken.

 

1 hour ago, timseb said:

But mostly I was puzzled by your hinting at China would somehow be a desirable global leader.

 

And why wouldn't it be?

 

All past empires, including the current American one (yes, not a empire, but you get what I mean, right?) are built on war and death. China, if it ever comes to that, might be the first that is built mostly on soft power (commerce + development). It could be better, worst or the same - but at least it could be an interesting shift in our understanding of the world. What we currently haveonly works for us rich folks, but not for the rest of the world. Since western powers are pretty clear on maintaining the current status quo ad eternum, the question should be whether if China can change the world for the better? And the answer is: by themselves, most probably not. What I am hoping for is that a positive conflict between China (+ their allies) and the old guard might bring that change about. A negative conflict could do that as well, but let's hope it doesn't come to that, despite foreign armies, and particularly those at odds with China, insisting that their ultimate goal is "war". I am going to reduce this to the basics, but China is not actually interested on war because a)who'd they sell all their crap to?, b)their country doesn't really lack natural resources or c)whatever they lack, nowadays it's easier to buy than to take by force. Moreover, the western discourse always brings up Taiwan, Hong Kong, the Senkaku Islands or the South China Sea to support these claims. This is, for the most part, BS: Taiwan and HK are internal unresolved colonial and war issues, which China has the right to take part in; the Senkaku Islands are quite the average territorial dispute between two countries, nothing to write home about; the South China issue is more tricky since it can be understood both as China being "greedy" as well as the result of third parties forcing their hand. Again, all in all this is the same kind of BS western countries pull all over the world and I don't see anyone complaining about that with the same fervour (and no, it's not about justifying China - I am just pointing out how messed up our civilization is).

 

1 hour ago, timseb said:

If that's not some joke I'm missing, future discussion would be futile.

 

Lol - I always find this kind of comment problematic. I could bore everyone here on "why", but I'll just say that it's foolish to maintain that position on a space aimed at encouraging discussion... and on a sino-centric forum at that. But you do you.